Bitter after taste??

Discussion in 'Homebrewing' started by hdrider, Jul 16, 2014.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. hdrider

    hdrider Initiate (0) Jan 16, 2008 Michigan

    So here is the scoop...
    Designed and brewed a New Holland Black Tulip clone.
    O.G. 1.095
    F.G. 1.018
    Sat on 3 vials (dont have a stir starter) WLP500 for 14 days. On day 4 brought ambient temp up to 74 deg for 8 hours Then back to 67 Deg ambient.
    Kegged on day 15 on 26 LBS of CO3
    Day 21 tasted it.

    S: Bananna, slight clove and a bit of Belgian funk
    A: Nice Gold to dark gold not too much haze looked real good
    T: Up front sweet belgian funk with noticeable undertones of bannana and clove........... Thats when it went to shit

    The brew tasted perfect then after swallowing the aftertaste was BITTER and mouth drying Lasting for some time.
    My theory is that It should have went to secondary or not even been tasted for another month or two.
    This is the second high gravity this has occurred on. Both started to be drank at about 3 weeks old. I have ruled out equipment cause other have been fine.
    Any input would be appreciated
     
  2. JohnSnowNW

    JohnSnowNW Zealot (556) Feb 6, 2013 Minnesota

    If it's an all-grain batch it's tannin extraction from the grain. If it's an extract batch it's tannin extraction from steeping the grain too hot, or long, or with too much water. Either way it sounds like you're describing astringency, from tannin extraction from the grain.
     
  3. hdrider

    hdrider Initiate (0) Jan 16, 2008 Michigan

    14.5 LBS grain 10 gallon converted cooler, with 21.32 QT of water for the mash
    Will this mellow with age? I sure hope so!! I have been meaning to get a PH test kit so I would not get the Tannins
     
  4. JohnSnowNW

    JohnSnowNW Zealot (556) Feb 6, 2013 Minnesota

    If it is tannin extraction, most likely only slightly, but probably not enough that you'd be happy with it. I'm only mentioning the most likely cause, based on your description.
     
  5. hdrider

    hdrider Initiate (0) Jan 16, 2008 Michigan

    That sucks! I dont think its too much water. I Bet the PH is off if that is what the problem is

    Thanks
     
  6. JohnSnowNW

    JohnSnowNW Zealot (556) Feb 6, 2013 Minnesota

    No worries. Are you using a specific brewing program?
     
  7. hdrider

    hdrider Initiate (0) Jan 16, 2008 Michigan

    beersmith2
     
  8. hopfenunmaltz

    hopfenunmaltz Meyvn (1,470) Jun 8, 2005 Michigan

    Astringency is a mouthfeel, not a taste. It is sensation that is like sand paper on your mouth, or like tea that is over steeped.

    If it is really bitter and lingering, did you add gypsum?
     
  9. hdrider

    hdrider Initiate (0) Jan 16, 2008 Michigan

    No, no gypsum added
     
  10. JohnSnowNW

    JohnSnowNW Zealot (556) Feb 6, 2013 Minnesota

    What were you using as your water program?
     
  11. JohnSnowNW

    JohnSnowNW Zealot (556) Feb 6, 2013 Minnesota

    The brew tasted perfect then after swallowing the aftertaste was BITTER and mouth drying Lasting for some time.

    My suggestion was based on the information in bold. That's how I would describe astringency, anyway.
     
  12. hdrider

    hdrider Initiate (0) Jan 16, 2008 Michigan

    good well water, lower gravity beers have been good as well as darker ones
     
  13. JohnSnowNW

    JohnSnowNW Zealot (556) Feb 6, 2013 Minnesota

    If you haven't had your water tested, and don't know the profile, it will be difficult to make consistent beers. Essentially you're mashing in the dark.

    I can understand that you are happy with how some of the other brews have come out, but you can avoid issues like this beer altogether if you know your profile and use a water program. Actually I'd advocate using Brewcipher, which was developed by a member here @VikeMan . Brewcipher will actually replace Beersmith as well for you, as it did for me.

    Anyway, I'd suggest sending a sample of your water off to Ward Labs for analysis. It's about $40, and you'll know everything you need to know about your water.
     
  14. hopfenunmaltz

    hopfenunmaltz Meyvn (1,470) Jun 8, 2005 Michigan

    There is a difference in the two. You have to experience the difference, then you can determine if a beer is bitter or astringent.
     
  15. hopfenunmaltz

    hopfenunmaltz Meyvn (1,470) Jun 8, 2005 Michigan

    Agreed.

    OP - well water in Micigan is usually very alkaline. Not so my good for beer.
     
  16. kjyost

    kjyost Meyvn (1,202) May 4, 2008 Manitoba (Canada)

    Nothing to do with bitterness / astringency, but I would definitely have left this beer on the yeast longer than 14 days! That's a pretty big OG!
     
    premierpro and PapaGoose03 like this.
  17. BushDoctor

    BushDoctor Initiate (0) Oct 27, 2007 New York

    You did get a little warm and combined with the high gravity, it could be phenols giving you some spice/bitterness. I have used Wyeast golden strong and have gotten some heavy phenols while pushing fermentation temp to the upper end. After packaging the beer the yeast took a long time to flocculate, which is where the phenols was coming from, because after the yeast settled to the bottom the beer was smooth. Drinking the dregs, I could taste the phenols. Harder to see when the yeast floccs on a keg. Leave the beer for a couple of months and then revisit.
     
  18. hopfenunmaltz

    hopfenunmaltz Meyvn (1,470) Jun 8, 2005 Michigan

    I see BushDoctor hit was I was just thinking, yeast bite if the yeast have not flocculated/dropped out.

    OP - if you bottled keep a bottle cold for a few days, then when you drink it make sure to not get any yeast out of the bottle so pour gently. If you noticed a difference it is yeast giving the off flavor.
     
  19. JohnSnowNW

    JohnSnowNW Zealot (556) Feb 6, 2013 Minnesota

    He kegged, but that aside, this is certainly another possibility.
     
  20. hopfenunmaltz

    hopfenunmaltz Meyvn (1,470) Jun 8, 2005 Michigan

    Didn't go back and read it. I usually dump the first pint or two from a keg, as I find the yeast in an IPA can be pretty bitter as they bind some of the IBUs to their membranes. Once the yeast have settled out and the beer is bright, you don't get that.
     
  21. BushDoctor

    BushDoctor Initiate (0) Oct 27, 2007 New York

    I have drank the bottle dregs of a heavily hopped IPA, and that was a blast of bitter lupulin. The only commerical beer I have ever seen lupulin glands in was Troegs' Perpetual IPA, I got the last growler fill from a keg that kicked mid-pour.
     
  22. hdrider

    hdrider Initiate (0) Jan 16, 2008 Michigan

    UPDATE...
    Its only been a couple weeks since first trying and getting that taste. Cracked one to try it (impatient I am) The taste is almost gone already. still hints of it but nothing like it was. I guess it was (and is) too "green" yet. Brewing another batch of it this weekend! This time however it will sit in a secondary for 60 days and get bottle conditioned. This stuff is almost exactly like New Hollands Black Tulip.
    Thanks for all the help folks!
     
  23. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Poo-Bah (4,179) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Society

    Glad to hear that your beer turned out well.

    It sounds like your yeast settled out over time.

    Cheers!
     
    hdrider likes this.
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.