Bourbon County 2017

Discussion in 'Great Lakes' started by whatruDOINdragic, Jun 11, 2017.

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  1. Bryan71

    Bryan71 Initiate (108) Apr 22, 2015 Illinois

    Okay, let's tackle one issue, wouldn't you think handing out numbers early would be the easy part? I can't imagine they don't have security for that place when they are closed. I thought I once heard Binny's LP has a $5M inventory, a flammable one at that (point being the insurance company might require a 24 hour presence). So the security guard comes out every hour, hands out numbers, takes the name of the last person he hands a number to and then does it again an hour later after finding the guy that got the last number. As it gets closer to daybreak, he does it more often. It's an easy solution. Same security guard sees open containers or people out of hand, ask them nicely to leave. If they don't, call the CPD, easy.

    For those complaining about the size of the line and how it's changed the past couple of years, anybody that has brought a buddy or significant other to mule or because you were trying to get them into it, well you're to blame. I can't imagine there aren't too many of us that haven't tried to get a close friend involved. Then they do the same and the next thing you know you go from #200 at Binny's last year to #850, even though you showed up an hour earlier. It's happened to me at other releases.

    To whomever said something about paying 1.5x on Thanksgiving, come on man, that's the law. I'd go for at least 2x if I had to deal with a bunch of drunks that pass out in Porta Johns. Speaking of, anybody know if that guy is okay and more importantly, did he make it back for his allotment :grinning:?
     
  2. Cam9191

    Cam9191 Initiate (120) Nov 12, 2012 Colorado
    Trader

    I quit waiting in line last year after doing it for 3 years. I know getting variants is awesome, but the reasons I quit doing this are I'm pretty satisfied with regulars for aging (Oh heck, this year is pretty good), you can easily hunt down variants on taps within a month AND I like to sleep in after being in a food coma and drunk from Thanksgiving.

    I would absolutely love to get my hands on variants every year without waiting in line so I think Goose Island and/or Binnys should set up a system similarly to what Founders does with KBS and CBS releases. Maybe they should offer beer nerds different options of allocations they want, especially for those people who aren't big fans of BW and fruity stouts like myself and and times they can pick theirs up.
     
  3. Askchucky

    Askchucky Initiate (106) May 2, 2011 Illinois
    Trader

    small store by me had 3 cases of 2016 Barleywine on floor and cases behind counter of 2017 barleywine. At 24.99 per bottle I can see why. Passed.
     
  4. Chuckdiesel24

    Chuckdiesel24 Meyvn (1,318) Jul 6, 2016 Illinois
    Trader

    These aren’t solutions, this is just hoping people will act a certain way despite ample evidence that they won’t.
    Also, it’s easy to say, “crowd should self manage”. What if the cutter just doesn’t care. Are you gonna kick his ass? Are you willing to go to jail?
     
  5. flat_lander

    flat_lander Crusader (752) May 11, 2016 Illinois
    Society Trader

    If you're looking for regular, check Meijer. Both my stores have it sitting out at $10.99 per. One place had no limit, the other had limit 2. The one I was just at probably had 4 cases sitting out in singles. It'll be funny when later this week or early next week they also have CBS sitting next to it.
     
  6. Nbrock24

    Nbrock24 Devotee (416) Mar 11, 2016 Illinois
    Trader

    Binny’s wants the line. Goose really, really wants the line. They may not want the unintended consequences from this year but their arrangement is hugely beneficial for both of them. For those who want a ticketed release, isn’t that what Rare/Prop Day is?
     
  7. SinBoldly

    SinBoldly Initiate (39) Apr 21, 2014 Illinois
    Trader

    Don’t know if this is south enough or too far west, but Extra Value in Naperville might have Northwoods left.
     
  8. Hop-Trollop

    Hop-Trollop Initiate (104) Apr 27, 2012 Illinois

    I agree with 1-1000 (or whatever) all get the same beer. No options, 1 bundle. All packaged up and ready to go. Don’t like it, go somewhere else. Too much $ for you? Sell the rest to your friends.
     
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  9. Nbrock24

    Nbrock24 Devotee (416) Mar 11, 2016 Illinois
    Trader

    The Great Barleywine Market Crash of 2018
     
  10. prior2two

    prior2two Disciple (397) Oct 18, 2013 Illinois
    Trader

    But you can’t reasonably expect Binnys to enforce the line when it comes to people leaving, especially if they have Porto potties set-up.

    How is any outside force supposed to police that? Have someone walk the line and bust out a stop watch if someone leaves to take a piss? With a line this long and an unticketed entry, you can’t stop people from leaving/and coming back.


    There are solutions to other problems. Crack down on drinking. Ban tents. Those 2 things would do wonders. No tents and you’re not creating giant gaps in the line and a large number of people leaving and returning at the same time.
     
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  11. t4haughton

    t4haughton Initiate (71) Jan 24, 2013 Illinois
    Trader

    I'm glad to see at least a few shop owners understand how math and business work. I don't see why everyone insists on some beers being priced so far below the demand curve. (Bourbon County specifically). Nobody demands Busch light be priced at $2/case, where it would sell out instantly in many markets. On the other end, I don't recall too many people arguing Fifty Fifty Eclipse is stupid because it sits on shelves at $30/bomber.
     
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  12. Bryan71

    Bryan71 Initiate (108) Apr 22, 2015 Illinois

    Good grief, you people give it a rest! Clearly this shop owner doesn't understand it, thus why it's still sitting on the floor. Besides, Goose/AB/InBev sets the MSRP. Shops that gouge are at risk of getting the products pulled the following year. It does not do Goose/AB any good to have their specialty products sitting around and thus not creating a buzz. Goose has to absolutely love the stories of folks standing in line and having people stop and ask what everybody is waiting for. Besides, the manufacturers don't set an MSRP because they have nothing else better to do. They have determined that's a fair price where everybody makes money, but low enough that the consumer will still want to purchase the product. Just because it moves in Chicago and St. Louis, doesn't mean that's what happens in other parts of the country. I saw 14 cases of regular sitting on the floor of a Total Wine in SW Florida yesterday, it was priced at $10.99. I have seen similar instances in the past in Texas, Colorado, and WY. Goose certainly can't jack the price up in one market and not another. What I think would happen if the price was increased say by 60% or more is that you would see a lull for one year and then the consumers would adjust. After the initial shock of such a large increase, folks would line up to buy BCBS again as long as they thought the price was fair as it related to the market. Thus you aren't paying 60% over what Binny's or Sam's charges. As mentioned numerous times in this thread, people choose not to buy when they feel a business proprietor is taking advantage of the situation. I said this last year when this came up, I passed on a Prop at $50 and likely will again from the same shop this year. I'm sure glad I did though, that beer is still trash from an ashtray. At any rate, I'd have no trouble paying that price if I thought it was fair as it relates to the market, but it is not. Finally, let's not forget that the Bourbon County line is still suffering from a bit of a lack in consumer confidence. Between the 2015 debacle, Maple Rye getting infected in 2016, and now whatever happened to 25th Anniversary Barleywine in 2017, some folks are still a little reluctant to stockpile. Adjusting the price upwards any time soon certainly isn't going to help the situation.
     
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  13. t4haughton

    t4haughton Initiate (71) Jan 24, 2013 Illinois
    Trader

    Do you think this was the only beer on the floor? I'm guessing they probably had other beer in stock. A shop owner isn't a bad business person for having inventory.

    The "S" stand for suggested.

    I see Halia, Gilian, Juliet, and Lolita all regularly sitting on the shelf at my local shop (all for more than a bottle of Prop, by the way). Goose doesn't set the MSRP of those beers to a point where they sell out immediately?

    What's your point? I saw a pallet of Regular at Costco yesterday at $8.89/bottle. I bought two cases. At $0.80/bottle I probably would have brought in a fork lift and rented a truck. At $80/bottle, I wouldn't have purchased a single bottle. I suspect Regular is priced close to correctly at $15/bottle in most markets. It's the variants that are WAY underpriced.

    Maybe. People make buying decisions for a lot of reasons. But anytime a product is priced significantly under its market value, you will find people looking to resell (trade) the product. We can see this perfectly in the demand for "on-site consumption" bottles vs. "off-site consumption" bottles. When bottles could sell for more (or sell out faster) for off-site consumption, we know we have a disparity in pricing.

    Good for you. But I'm confident if you posted the name of that location, it'd be gone within the day. Maybe you're only buying beer you intend to drink. But the reality is, beer is a commodity (particularly because of zoned distribution) and somebody who knows that will buy it and resell/trade it.

    Listen closely, I say this as somebody who studied economics at a Big Ten university... Bourbon County is a process intensive beer to produce. As far as we can tell, Goose Island is basically making as much as they can. What we have here is a very simple situation of demand outpacing supply. In this case, adjusting the price upwards is literally the ONLY thing that will help the situation.
     
  14. Dupage25

    Dupage25 Aspirant (234) Jul 4, 2013 Antarctica

    On Thanksgiving, I opened a 2012 Bourbon County Stout. It was great, though I'm now convinced most vintages peak at 2 or 3 years.

    On Black Friday, I rolled over in bed at around 7:30, grabbed my phone, googled "Bourbon County 2017," and this thread was the first thing that came up. I clicked to the then-last page (around 34 if I remember correctly) to see what the situation was. Read comments like "got here at 11pm last night, ticket #330," "they just gave me ticket #1047 and there's hundreds behind me," and "here in Dupage County both local Binnys have lines 100+ deep." (note: not verbatim quotes).

    I chuckled, rolled over, and went back to sleep.

    At 11am I strolled into a Jewel and got two bottles---no lines. At 11:30am I strolled into a Marianos and got two bottles---no lines, and they were right on the floor. Satisfied, I went home. I could have hunted more, but I still have bottles going back to 2013, so four bottles of 2017 is fine.


    If you live in Chicagoland or are just traveling through it on or around Black Friday, you don't need to wait in line for Bourbon County. Just remember that. I got a bunch with minimal effort.
     
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  15. Dupage25

    Dupage25 Aspirant (234) Jul 4, 2013 Antarctica

    It wouldn't be a crash if they just made it the way they used to (eg, reused BCBS barrels). People who insist that there is some magical, comparable alternative to BCBS that's easier to find and/or cheaper are off their rocker, but there really are a thousand bourbon-BA English barleywines all over the place. There was only one bourbon-stout-BA English barleywine, and Goose got rid of it. No reason to hunt for the current (generic) iteration of BCBB.
     
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  16. eppie82

    eppie82 Meyvn (1,408) Apr 19, 2015 Illinois
    Trader

    If you’re going after just regular, then yes, you can get those with relative ease on day off or even week or two after. But that’s not why there were crazy lines. It was because of the variants and the amount in the allotment.
     
  17. Dupage25

    Dupage25 Aspirant (234) Jul 4, 2013 Antarctica

    ...so people were actually lined up for Blueberry Biscotti Break--er, Bourbon County? Really? Prop maybe, and I know an absurd amount of people have an unhealthy fetish for the coffee variant, but I have a hard time believing Northwoods was that highly sought after. And nobody cares about Barleywine ever since they changed/ruined the aging recipe.

    Lots of people line up for the regular Bourbon County every year in the Chicago area, and they don't need to.
     
  18. eppie82

    eppie82 Meyvn (1,408) Apr 19, 2015 Illinois
    Trader

    You clearly haven’t been following along so not much point in going back and forth, so I’ll leave it at this: to know the demand of Prop, Reserve, and the rest, just find your way into ISO:FT forum and take a gander over the last 5-10 pages.
     
  19. Dupage25

    Dupage25 Aspirant (234) Jul 4, 2013 Antarctica

    Well, no, I don't follow the ISO:FT forum. I've honestly never thought it was a good barometer for secondary markets.
     
  20. JJH1018

    JJH1018 Initiate (189) Sep 13, 2013 Illinois

    Yeah Naperville isn't too far. Thank you sir!
     
  21. eppie82

    eppie82 Meyvn (1,408) Apr 19, 2015 Illinois
    Trader

    The demand in those forums will tell you how much people are seeking out the much more limited variants. That demand is the reason for the long lines which resulted in Chicagoland. Prop and Reserve seem particularly in high demand, with Northwoods and Coffee also garnering a lot of the demand. My point was to highlight that demand and it being the primary reason for the very long lines. It wasn’t the regular or the barleywine.

    Secondary market is a separate discussion, but we don’t need economics degrees from a Big Ten school to know that high demand on one of the biggest trade forums correlates (to whatever degree) to high demand in secondary.
     
  22. Jsimansk

    Jsimansk Initiate (151) Jul 10, 2012 Illinois
    Trader

    There were a good number of people (dozens to as many as a couple hundred) who were lined up at LP pretty early just because they thought they had a chance at VR and Prop 14 based on prior years. Higher limits on ‘17s made that decision easier to swallow. By the time most realized there was only 12 of each vintage, it was just too late to turn back.
     
  23. Chuckdiesel24

    Chuckdiesel24 Meyvn (1,318) Jul 6, 2016 Illinois
    Trader

    You guys were saying that either people shouldn’t be so crummy or the line should police itself. These are both pie in the sky. People are crummy, and I’m saying people in line sometimes do say something - and have no power to do anything when the line cutters ignore them.

    If you can’t reasonably expect Binny’s to enforce the line (I agree - it would be an impossible challenge with that line), why is it that you can expect them to enforce no tents or no drinking? On their property, they can. That’s a very small portion of this line though.
     
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  24. KBS

    KBS Disciple (313) Apr 25, 2014 Michigan
    Trader

    Why do you focus on the demand side and advocate raising prices instead of the supply side? Couldn’t they produce as much variants as regular, including prop with full distro. They would still sell out relatively quickly since the demand seems to be there.
     
  25. macewank

    macewank Initiate (171) Aug 28, 2010 Illinois

    Where are they going to store all of those barrels?
     
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  26. HouseofWortship

    HouseofWortship Champion (888) May 3, 2016 Illinois
    Trader

    Personally, I think if you leave the line for any reason, you go to the end. That's what is taught in kindergarten, none of this "we'll make exceptions" crap. You have to use the restroom while in line? Tough cookies, you lined up too early then , return to "Go" and do not collect $200....
     
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  27. whatruDOINdragic

    whatruDOINdragic Initiate (164) Aug 22, 2013 Illinois
    Trader

    From now on I’m cutting any cutter I see and encouraging everyone else to do the same.
     
  28. ratwheels

    ratwheels Initiate (0) Jan 12, 2011 Illinois

    I'm just responding to this piece of your post.

    I was there. I got there at 3 a.m. and I was in the delivery truck bank of Best Buy (directly behind it). It definitely was NOT a free for all as tents collapsed. We walked east on Willow to the corner of Willow and Marcey. We crossed over to the north side of Willow and eventually turned right and headed back north on Kingsbury. The people who got fucked were those people who decided to wrap around back into the Binny's parking lot (as a number of people didn't wait for them and crossed the driveway to Binny's before they all got out of the parking lot).

    I was #675 in line and maybe 50 people cut in front of me (some people were dicks and jumped straight across Willow on Kingsbury without making the turn). I suppose there could have been mass cutting up on Wisconsin but with how much the line collapsed, I doubt it.
     
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  29. PhilBallins

    PhilBallins Aspirant (241) Nov 29, 2016 Illinois

    This may just be because I'm a pampered millennial, but I never sat in a 12 hour line in kindergarten.
     
  30. fmd

    fmd Initiate (75) Nov 30, 2015 Illinois
    Trader

    [​IMG]

    If it's good enough for the Goose, it's good enough for y'all. Man up.
     
  31. Ace99890

    Ace99890 Aspirant (228) Dec 3, 2013 Illinois
    Trader

    I think the secondary market is the real problem here. In one of my Facebook beer groups, BCS variants have been going up for sale in what seems like every 20 min and for rediculus prices. The stuff is worth money and these douchebags know it and will exploit it. Until people stop paying for it, this will never stop. It just pisses me off that there's people who actually want to drink the beer or share it with friends and they can't even get it because these jerks go buy it all and then turn around and sell it for Max profitz....such BS
     
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  32. thing85

    thing85 Initiate (39) Jul 8, 2012 Illinois

    The upside is, you won't see "empty" beer bottles all over the place. It's like they say, when life gives you beer, make lemonade.
     
  33. BCB1908

    BCB1908 Initiate (69) Dec 4, 2012 Illinois

    This. I would like to have 1 of each variant like I got last year. I've passed up plenty of chances to buy more regular. It's good, but I don't need to horde it.
     
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  34. thereal

    thereal Initiate (98) Apr 20, 2010 Illinois

    Binny's won't spend any more money on the event unless they are forced to. Not on line watchers. Not on tickets or people to hand out tickets. Not on anti-drinking monitors. Why would they? Most of y'all will be back next year.

    If you really want to see a change, one bout of alcohol poisoning is not going to do it. You need to step up your game, and get someone stabbed, or have a giant all out brawl. Maybe graphic waiting in line intercourse. Otherwise the bottom line is more important, and the extra money will not be spent.
     
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  35. croush

    croush Champion (803) Mar 20, 2015 Illinois
    Trader

    Did anyone go to the Capone's release yesterday? I had gone the last couple years, but couldn't take the half day off work to go. I know he was going to have a real limited amount of variants, so wondered how many people got variants (besides BW). He had mentioned to me only about the first 30 people or so, which made me think they'd have about 3 cases worth.
     
  36. fmd

    fmd Initiate (75) Nov 30, 2015 Illinois
    Trader

    Exaggerations aside, I firmly believe this is why they only had four points of sale. Didn't want to have extra employees to man additional posts. Even then though, you could have shuffled around the people you did have. E.g. the manager who was the 2nd guy checking ids at the gate could have been checking people out instead. If they solved the checkout problem, a vast majority of the bottleneck is resolved.
     
  37. scream

    scream Meyvn (1,294) Dec 6, 2014 Wisconsin

    and on Ebay, empty cartons and empty btls. for stupid prices
     
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  38. fmd

    fmd Initiate (75) Nov 30, 2015 Illinois
    Trader

    Is counterfeiting beer a thing? There's a cool documentary about counterfeiting wine on Netflix, but wouldn't think the margins are there on beer. One prop bottle + box + Wells Banana Bread Beer = For sale Prop17, $100.

    This is the literal only reason I could think as to why anyone would pay a non trivial amount for empty bottles/boxes. I get people and their need to craft with this stuff...but come on.
     
  39. JJH1018

    JJH1018 Initiate (189) Sep 13, 2013 Illinois

    That blows my mind they only had 4 POS. Hell the Mokena Binny's I think had 6 or 7 and there was probably only 150 - 200 people there.
     
  40. jl0pes

    jl0pes Initiate (53) Dec 16, 2014 Illinois
    Trader

    I couldn't make it either but stopped by after work. He got lots of cases of reg, 5 cases of BW and 1 case of each variant.
     
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