BrewDog Berlin

I appreciate the response and understand it to a very small degree, but we are on opposite ends of this argument. To me Berlin is a "lebendige Stadt" with a pretty fascinating history, to boot. Add in the fact that it has amazing museums and cultural sites and is on par in terms of cost of living (if not lower) than boring ol' Heidelberg and to me it's a no brainer. That fact that it was the national seat of government during very turbulent times is more of an historical coincidence to me. All other arguments probably border on political and I'll table them until our BA meet-up, whenever and where ever that may be.

 

yes, when and where will this meet up be?

 

I don't really care if you (or anyone) share my emotions or not (and I most definetly don't expect anyone to follow me in this), I'm merely trying to explain that my feelings for Berlin are largely clouded by history and current political events and have very little to do with beer.

If you want to burn Germany at the stake, by my guest. I'm Bavarian. You can give the rest of Germany to France, Holland, Denmark and Poland for all I care.

 

Good question.

 

The first nomination was February/March-ish at Faust (Miltenberg), since the invitation was so kindly extended by a fellow BA. Stahlsturm nominated Regensburg and environs, which I'm happy to do also, although because a BA invited us up to Faust I'm kind of leaning that direction.

 

I like the Faust/Miltenberg idea, have not tried a lot of their beers, but their alkoholfreiweizen is the best I have had and a staple when I got to Ultimate (frisbee) tournaments.

Feb/March works for me, especially after Feb 14

 

Have you been to all of them?

Personally, I liked Berlin for its "feel" and history, but I'd choose from many others if I was looking to relocate.

(MJ -- changing your avatar is disconcerting, I thought you were some new member here to rattle Stahl!)

 

http://www.adlersberg.com/brauerei-...ezialitaeten/palmator-dunkler-doppelbock.html

 

Funny, I had a Bosnian friend in America who used the same argument to justify murdering and subjugating Kosovars. Substitute Kosovar for Berlin and it would be him virtually verbatim. Now, I'm not saying anyone here wants to murder or subjugate anyone else, but I'm sorry, I find if we all felt that like that, there would never be an end to any wars, or we'd all be isolationists. It also seems these same sentiments caused WWI and WWII. Also, interestingly, this line of thinking seems very foreign to most Americans, who actually, unlike Europeans, seem to live "outside of history," in other words, American forgive and often forget, then get about the business of working on the future. I think a lot of the people in the new German states have this attitude, too, of looking to the future rather than obsessing about the past.

I can understand a dislike of a giant city from people who live in small towns or smaller cities, for the culture and quality of life is hugely different. I have felt the same thing when transitioning from small city to big city. This seems to me a more plausible explanation for your animosity, Stahly.

Personally, I liked the touristy things in Berlin, too, such as museums, etc, but I it was other things I liked there, like the energy in Berlin, the avant garde lifestyle that's been part of (West) Berlin since the 60's, that Berliners aren't afraid to try new things, and the feeling that around every corner there's a cool, interesting and quirky shop/restaurant/etc. to discover.

 

I prefer Miltenberg/Faust due to its being near me, and Regensburg is much much farther for me by train, unless I get my driver's license before then, and then it's much much farther by car.

 

I will change my attitude towards Berlin the day the German occupation of Bayern ends.

Wrong, I actually like big cities. Not necessarily to spend my life there but to visit, Hell yes.

If they'd pay for their party they'd be welcome to it. As it stands, they are not.

 

Well, if the consensus will fall on Miltenberg I'll show but personally I think it's not right that a BA Germany forum meeting would happen at the border of Unterfranken to Hessen. No matter how good that one brewery may be, I can offer 3 or 4 a day for 2 weeks...

And yes, I know I'm (ever so slightly) exaggerating but still, you get my point, don't you ?

 

One thing that holds true in all my traveling and living around the world is that stupidity transcends all cultural barriers. This is not a prevailing Bosnian ideology, but more that of a racist idiot, just like the KKK still exists in the US. Hell, the city where my parents live finally decided after over 50 years that having a high school named after the first grand wizard of the KKK was a bad idea.

In general Americans know very little about anything outside the US, let alone the US.
US history according to most Americans is: Columbus discovered the US, we had a few skirmishes with Indians, but that is ok it was God's plan for us to go west, we were nice to immigrants or they were evil spies, we have brought democracy to the world and we invented everything and are the best and freest country in the world! Murica oorah!!!


cheers and I like Mitlenberg too, but mostly bc it is marginally quicker to get to by train.

 

Unfortunately, this is mostly true.

 

Fittingly enough for this conversation, that is some graffiti from the Berlin Wall (East Side gallery if I remember correctly). I promise it wasn't me who put it there.

 

My one and only trip to Berlin was with 2 veteran friends who felt the need to see what they'd been defending all those years. Was one year after the fall -- and street signs were a bit dodgy. Somehow we drove a semi-circle around the city and entered Check Point Charlie from the east. Sure glad it wasn't a couple years before.

To that, the only place we could find with lodging was a Pension -- not the most glamorous night I spent in Germany, but at least it was nearby a great Croat restaurant with outstanding food. Sorry, can't recall what beer they served.

 

I kind of understand Stahlsturm's reason for not liking Berlin, but I don't feel the same way. Since I'm not Bavarian nor Prussian, and those things are way beyond my grand-grandparents' generation. Prussia annexing almost all princedoms/kingdoms, etc. in the 19th century eventually led to WWI and WWII and subsequently to German separation and reunification. But in 1871 it also created Germany as a nation, which it had never been before. And this, I believe, is a thing most Germans (including Bavarians) are grateful for.
I like Berlin as a city to visit, there's a lot to see and visit and many places just sum up this short German history as one nation. And there are a lot of different people, different neighborhoods, restaurants, museums, bars, etc., etc. What I always find lacking about Berlin is a clear kind of city center as even other cities in that size-category have. It's like a micro-Germany: many small or middle-sized towns and cities put together under the name of Berlin. The actual city center (Bezirk Mitte) is more or less an outdoor museum.
And another thing I dislike about Berlin as our capital is its distance from "where Germany is". Berlin pretty much lies in a rural area of nothing. For me, the German center lies within the "Blue Banana", along the big cities on the Rhine, via Rhine/Main-area down to the cities of the south (Stuttgart/Munich). When it came to selecting a capital in 1949, Frankfurt would have been an obvious choice (also given its history), but Adenauer wanted to stay at home and made his buddies vote for Bonn. I know, Germany is a small country, but I always just feel that Berlin is more or less its own thing, far away from the centers of Germany.

Still, my favorite big city in Germany is Hamburg. Beats Berlin easily.

 

I need to get myself to Hamburg. It's the one city that nearly every German recommends.

 

Berlin used to be a lot more central. Until the Allies decided to let Uncle Joe have his way and move Poland west anyways...

Hamburg (as well as Köln) has always been a lot more open to the World. Just look at the history. Hamburg as a an independent Hanse trading town having ties all over the World through the harbour , Berlin as the landlocked capital of grumpy Preussen.