CO2 vs Sugar Carbonation / Conditioning

I don't know, but I'm sure the CAMRA folks would be stoked to hear about it.

But are you sure you have carbonated both beers...
A) Fully
- and -
B) To the same CO2 level?

 

Campaign for Real Ale. (No "artificial" carbonation.)

The reason I asked is that CO2 level can affect both flavor and mouthfeel.

 

I carbonate with sugar in the keg all the time. You don't have to force carbonate with CO2.

 

the debate around natural carbonation, that is CO2 generated from yeast and captured in the vessel vs. "artificial" carbonation, or CO2 that has been applied under pressure in the vessel has been around for decades. CAMRA people seem nice enough, but it is established that CO2 is CO2 is CO2. don't tell the CAMRA folks though, they won't hear it.

however, keg beer does require some extra time to condition, not in terms of the carbonation, but their is usually a green character to keg beer for a while even after it has reached the proper vols. the length of time required varies. patience.

so you may find that your keg beer will have better texture and flavor after a few weeks of quiet cold conditioning.
Cheers.

 

This is an excellent point. In my experience kegged beers continue to improve over time: The carbonation takes on a finer quality after 2-3 weeks, the beer gets clearer, and flavors become more blended and mature. Obviously, the extent of these improvements and the amount of time before flavors finally begin to degrade will be dependent upon things like style, ABV, and your ability to avoid oxygen exposure. But it would be a good experiment to keg and bottle condition the same beer and sample it over time. (Anybody done that?) My guess is that the bottle conditioned beer might taste better at first, but the kegged beer would surpass it after 3-4 weeks and would remain at its peak for a longer period.

 

@kfkehua , maybe your kegged beer just needs more time for the CO2 to become hydrated in the beer?

Below is something that Martin Brungard posted on another beer forum:

“We know we can infuse CO2 into solution fairly quickly. The soda manufacturers do that every day. Nice coarse and effervescent bubbles are formed. But with time, CO2 is hydrated and I feel that this mechanism is key to the change in carbonation quality that we brewers desire. The hydration of CO2 is a very time-dependent process and it cannot be accelerated. That is why you can force carbonate a keg in minutes, yet not have acceptable foam for a few weeks.”

Maybe give the kegged beer another 1-2 weeks and try another side-by-side tasting?

Cheers!

 

My first question would be, how accurate is your co2 regulator?

 

From my slightly limited experience, I agree. While many people will say kegging beer is faster and you can have fizzy beer in 2-7 days, IMO you don't get nearly the mouthfeel or even best tasting beer in that time frame. So yes, even kegged beer needs time to condition from my experience. When young, I find there is more of the carbonation bite. Not to mention it may be even tougher if you keep playing with the co2 levels after trying to force carb quickly.

 

As far as my limited practice gos, I might suggest that you might like to extend the experiment and do both ways in to on one keg. Prime it for 30% of the co2 level and after 10 days force to the target co2 level.

 

The last beer from the keg is ALWAYS the best beer from that keg, I wonder if this new gadget would be worth looking into?

Then again, you could just wait it out

 

You see repeated from time to time that "CO2 is CO2" and at a simplistic level this is true.CO2 isolated from a new born baby is the same as that from a volcano. But things aren't as simple as they seem, CO2 isn't simply dissolved in the beer.If it were then the makers of Champagne and other quality sparkling wines would cut a lot of the cost of production by bypassing remuage and dégorgement and simply force carbonating.You have only to open a bottle of decent bubbly together with a cheap sparkling wine to see a difference.
It's not a matter so much as what CO2 is but how it gets there.Yeast makes it through a long and involved process, the final intermediary compound breaks down to yield the CO2. But under conditions of high pressure, in fine accordance with le Chatelier's Principle (elementary chemistry) the breakdown is inhibited.When the pressure is released the reaction gradually resumes with the result that CO2 is slowly evolved. This is why Champagne effervesces for a longer period than simple sparkling wine.
There is also of course a chemical reaction between CO2 and water forming carbonic acid, which under the same principle is stable under pressure but when the bottle is opened breaks down again to give free gas.
I'm trying to remember this from my undergraduate course and as it was 50 years ago ............

 

Please explain why this "slowly evolved" CO2 is different in the end, and how this causes Champagne to effervesce longer. If I understand what you wrote, you're saying it's different because the process that made it is different. Do you think that when a bottle of champagne is opened, CO2 is suddenly being made again (slowly) by fermentation?

Yes, there is. How does that change depending on the original source of the CO2?

 

Not by continued fermentation but by the breakdown of the intermediate compounds already there.



Yes, there is. How does that change depending on the original source of the CO2?
That doesn't.That's all about the free/dissolved part.

 

So there are intermediate compounds sitting there, waiting to become CO2? What are they?

 

someone earlier said something about CAMRA people and their beliefs surrounding CO2.

let me look into my crystal ball again...

I see many words written... an obscure scientific principle comes into view... I see.. wait... CASK ALE is appearing very strongly... yes there it is again... CASK ALE SUPERIOR... I am hearing an English accent now...

 

About this keg float system... What is it and where did you find it?