Conditioning/Bottling/Flavor change questions.

I do not want to generate too much alarm here but when a hoppy beer seems to suffer from "hop fade" the first thing that is discussed is the potential for oxidation. I am not intimately familiar with all of the details of the chemistry of oxidative reactions but it seems that observing results of oxidation so quickly (i.e., 9 days) is not likely? Can you provide more details on your bottling process with specific attention to exposure to air (oxygen) during bottling?

What water did you use to brew your beer? If you used municipal tap water what method did you use to eliminate chlorine/chloramine from the water?

Cheers!

 

@Hogue2112


“Siphon from secondary fermenter into bottling bucket.” I would recommend that you not use a secondary for future batches. It is unnecessary for most beer styles (exceptions are sours, fruited beers, oaked beers, lagers) and the transfer from primary to secondary is a risk of further aeration (oxygenation) of the beer plus the potential for infection.

“Avoiding splashing and keeping the siphon hose under the surface as much as possible.” Yup. you want to avoid splashing.

“We do not cover the bottling bucket once the beer has been transferred to it. Should we?” I do not cover my bottling bucket. Where aeration (oxygenation) is of most concern is rough handling (e.g., splashing), poor siphoning technique where you see bubbles (air) in the tubes, etc. Just having the beer on the top of the bottling bucket exposed to air is a lesser concern.

“However, I have been unable to determine if filtering through this 5 micron is enough treatment.” I have no familiarity with your water filtration system so I can’t provide comment here. I use a dual stage carbon block filtering system which greatly reduces the chloramine of my municipal tap water. I know this because I test the filtered water using Hach test strips: http://www.hach.com/free-total-chlorine-test-strips-0-10-mg-l/product?id=7640211603

The other option to reduce chloramine is to use campden tablets to pretreat the brewing water.



I want to emphasize that I am not definitively stating that your beer is suffering from oxidation given the timeframes being discussed (e.g., 9 days) but the symptoms you are describing are indeed consistent with oxidation.

Cheers!

 

When you transfer from primary to secondary, and then from secondary to bottling bucket, and then from bottling bucket to bottle, you are introducing oxygen each time. Secondary should really not be needed for an IPA. My normal process is to just go straight from the primary to the keg. If I was bottling and had a bottling bucket, I would just ferment in the bottling bucket and bottle directly.

My brewing experience is limited to well water and RO water, so I'll let others tackle the likely chloromine issue.

 

Forgot to ask if you use an autosiphon? I never use them since the bubbles in the transferring beer are always problematic for me.

 

I have no science to support that the effects of oxidative processes can be noticed so quickly but that is because the science I am aware of is for beer which has lower levels of packaged oxygen. Maybe if you really screwed up and introduced a 'boatload' of oxygen both during the transfers and the actual bottling process you would notice it at day 9?

No, I am sorry that I can't. Everything you have described is consistent with "hop fade" that occurs as a result of oxidative processes.

Me too.

Cheers!

 

I would suggest that there is little polarization on BA on this topic: do not conduct a secondary unless you absolutely have to (I gave examples above).

Cheers!

 

If it's just a particulate filter you won't be removing any chlorine/chloramines. An activated charcoal filter will remove chorine, but you will need to use other methods like campden for chloramines.

Do you have a water report for your municipal water? I think it's time for you to start paying attention to your water.

 

It sounds like you brew with a partner? If that's the case you can do what I do when I do bottle, ie have my wife hold my siphon in the primary while I bottle. No bottling bucket needed.

My issue with the auto siphon isnt during the "pumping". When I use one I see bubbles throughout the cane during the entire transfer. Just make sure you see no bubbles at all during the whole process

 

I can attest to swift oxidation do to bottling in my beers. Every beer that I keg has come out much better than any version of that beer that I bottled. If I were you, I would invest in a kegging system with a kegerator. this will run you like $500-1,000, but totally worth it in the end. either way, you dont need secondary. like you said, just get more 6.5 gallon carboys so you dont have to unnecessarily take your beers out of primary.

 

I have been homebrewing for over 20 years. I will be brewing batch number 375 in a few days. All of those beers have been bottled and I have never had issues with "swift oxidation". I have consumed beers that have been years in the bottle.

What exactly was your problem with oxygen ingress while bottling?

Cheers!

 

On the topic of chloramine, use the campden tablets. My carbon block filters cannot remove it, it is cheap insurance my friend.

 

It wasnt scross the board but happened way too often for my liking. hasnt happened while kegging yet and I bottle of the keg, now. all is good!!

 

I don't have an opinion yet about whether it might be oxidation as your problem, but I'll take another option as a potential reason for this off-flavor. Instead of 'medical/sterile taste' would you also describe the taste as banana or bubble gum? I think these tastes are similar and can be mixed-up when describing them. If so, then fermentation temps can enter into this picture as a reason for the off-taste. Here's a link to How To Brew's section on off flavors that might help you decide what you are tasting.
http://howtobrew.com/book/section-4/is-my-beer-ruined/common-off-flavors