i understand what you are saying, but this is all a series of "i don't believe" and "perhaps" and "it seems" statements with absolutely no evidence. i don't see how you can take a documented case of falsified beer in trading and turn it into an "a ha! ebay is bad!" argument. it simply doesn't work. here's how i see it: 1) there's no history of what trades have gone down on ba, at all. someone can post a "ft: nomad, iso: wales" and set up 10 different trades with 10 fake bottles. you'll never know what was traded or whom the bottles were traded to. there is no record. it's actually easier and faster to disseminate fake bottles through ba than through ebay (post too many for sale and you flood your own market since the sales are logged). 2) wales are rare enough that few people will have the chance to sit two bottles side by side and perform a comparison (this works as an argument for both trading and ebay falsification). 3) if you're "blackballed" on ba, you can start over and try again. look how many times fyrekrakker05 / urownnitemare / alldeybrewing (SAME GUY) hit ba over and over again. 4) the idea that anyone can be "blackballed" on ba with any sort of consensus is naive. worst case, you create a new account and ship first. hell, spin a convincing story about how you were banned for drunk posting a scumbag steve image, and people might not even question why a join date: today has a bottle of don quijote. 5) to sum up 1 and 2, it is easy to cheat in trades on ba. to sum up 3 and 4, there are no consequences to cheating in trades on ba. none. again, you are fixating on ebay and being almost willfully obtuse about the more immediate danger. i think you have an agenda, and i suggest that you put it aside to accept some of the ugly truths here.