Crystal - Why the hate?

Quoting Telejunkie: "Many of what people consider to be "old school" or "east coast" ipas actually have 0% crystal malts in them, eg DFH or Harpoon."
I though DFH was ALL crystal malts. Their beers were the ones that convinced me to cut crystal out of most of my recipes. What is it that makes their beer so cloying?
About the only time I use crystal malts these days is when I brew Pilsners I use some carapils, and low ABV UK style beers like bitters, brown, etc will get about a pound of crystal 40 or 60 per 10 gallon batch.

 

Likely its their yeast. 120 minute is something like 45% corn sugar and is still cloying sweet in spite of finishing out at somewhere around 0.992 FG (granted ethanol obstructs accurate gravity measurement).

Usually when I brew I do split batches and compare the finished profile of my beer fermented with a stock strain I typically use for that style (e.g. 1968 for a milk stout) with new strains I haven't used. The biggest night and day experience was comparing a milk stout fermented with London Ale III (Boddington's strain) with 1968 and S-04. The London Ale III was sickly sweet and cloying at nearly the same FG (almost had a straight sugar flavor/sweetness to it), whereas the 1968 and S-04 were balanced (malty but to style).

 

I think the difference is more than just being made from two row. Breiss makes 2 row caramel malt and it doesn't even deserve to be in the same building as Thomas Fawcett crystal malt. I wonder what varieties British maltsters are using to make their crystal malts. North American two row has decidedly less character than most European varieties, especially Maris Otter and Golden Promise. If Fawcett is making their crystal malt out of a superior base malt, then that might explain why it is so much better than even the high end American caramel malt.