Disabling Beer Karma

Here's another wish to bring back the beer karma. Like so many others have said, it was fun working towards acheivements -- drink a beer from all 50 states, xx amount of countries, etc. Also it definitely gave me incentive, as I'm sure it did others, to add new beers/places/pictures/reviews to the site. I was quite proud of the BA status I have earned throughout my time spent on this site.

 

The points didn't matter in Whose Line is it Anyway. But still, you got to do a hoe down at the end with Laura Hall if you had the most! Not bad.

 

Yes, beer karma encouraged beer community and behavior! I created a spreadsheet containing all of the styles, and had been researching specific beers to try and review to help me in my goal of trying all styles. This led me to stray from my comfortable favorite (stouts) and in the process I not only gained beer karma, I have also opened my mind to new styles and specific favorites (such as Weihenstephaner Hefe Weissbier and Lindeman Framboise). Similarly, I have been tracking states and would like to have a beer from each state. I have added a number of locations, including international, and a number of beers. I had been reluctant to review beers because I was unsure my opinion was worthwhile, but have recently embraced reviews in earnest. This, plus participation in these forums is what beer community is about, and how else can we currently measure it but with beer karma. Until something better comes along. But, since beer karma is gone this all seems pointless and un-measurable. I do believe that if I continue to try and review new beers and locations, that a follow-on system MIGHT EVENTUALLY provide some positive feedback for this effort.

 

I do miss the point system and beer karma, however that is not why I joined this site... I joined this site back in the day to review American Lagers. Then I really branched off into a new hobby. Trying different styles and such. I enjoy reviewing brews from all over. Every brew has a story and a flavor. I would like to see more reviews and not numbers... Numbers tell new people to site nothing in my opinion. Reading reviews before I buy something has also something I look forward to do.

 

I will add another vote to bring back beer karma. I've haven't been on the site as long as most, but BK added a fun aspect and definitely made me want to try new styles/breweries/countries/etc, and made me want to contribute more and spend more time on the forums. I do agree with some saying the valuation of points could be different, but I think bringing it back in some form is the right way to go. Hell, it's just a bit of fun, and we could all use more of that. I would also like to thank all the BA staff that make geeks like us having a site like this possible.

 

Aw, I like the Beer Karma.
It was a trivial but amusing self-rewarding system that encouraged participation and contribution.

 

I was deeply disappointed to see the Beer Karma point system done away with. I do appreciate that BA opened this forum to hear our feedback. It was definitely fun to see how established and seasoned other members were and while I realize some could take advantage of it I feel it definitely did add positive attributes to the website. Please bring it back

 

Not that my vote means a whole lot, but I, like many others, did enjoy the Beer Karma system and found it extra motivation to contribute content to the site. I am not a "likes" chaser (as can be easily seen by my meager stats), if that was the problem just don't count them for the WBAYDN threat and create a more meaningful distribution for adding real content. If the maintenance cost (you speak of overhead) is the real issue, I think we can all survive without the Karma. The true value of this site lies in getting accurate discriptions and feedback as a guideline for trying new beers and to keep updated with industry developments (releases, etc.). Just my two cents...

 

I liked it, and I was closing in on Poobah....only 100 more points to go!!!!

 

Going to echo what many have said - I'm in favor of bringing them back. It was a fun way to encourage people to comment, like, review, add pictures, and be good advocates on this site.

 

I have no problem with disabling beer karma (though it seems inevitable that it will be back). Here are some reasons:

#1. False Expertise. We all know and respect certain BA members regardless of the number or title next to their name. We trust them because we've read their opinions or we think they write witty reviews or we've shared bottles or traded with them many times. Sometimes those things lead to the appropriate level of "beer karma", but often they do not. For those of us here on a daily or bi-weekly basis, there is no need to give badges/points/titles. For the newbies or the once-a-month accounts, those things can often be misleading when deciding whether to "listen" to a member.

#2. Points tickers. We all know the loopholes in the system. You can pile up comments. You can shoot for the most "likes" on frequent photos of rare beers. You can tick beers and styles for a few days and grab a bunch of points. There are plenty of ways to gain significant points over just a few months. And like untapped, BA has become a forum that rewards tickers.

How about a system that gets more specific? I do like the "trader" title. If we must have points, then why not have more specific "points" and titles like "experienced trader", "experienced reviewer", "frequent commenter", etc? Since beeradvocate is a place to get into in depth discussions on the industry, why not tie in the Cicerone program? Maybe you could have a little I, II, III, or IV on your avatar/icon if you're certified at certain levels?

 

I prefer Karma Points to having the Joined Date present and visible.

We've all seen people harassed and put down for being "noobs" and not having a lot of "experience" but that only really applies to being signed up with a particular username on BeerAdvocate. It provides no value whatsoever in determining the validity of a users comments, and only offers the opportunity for certain folks to make judgments, intentional or not, on a user's experience.

For example, I used this site for years prior to actually signing up. I flipped over to creating an account because I decided I finally wanted to participate, but also wanted to use the more trackable trading system. I had been involved in craft beer in some form or other for much longer.

I think in the end it's pretty obvious when someone is new to the culture versus when someone is well-versed, and that ultimately the Joined Date does a disservice to everyone.

 

Although I thought it was kind of fun, I'm sure it lead to alot of fake reviews and people trolling for likes. Maybe I'm just cynical, but I'm ok with that

 

On one hand, I didn't even realize it was gone until another user referenced it in another thread, so maybe it's not the end of the world that it's gone.

On the other hand, I have to admit enjoying the chase/hunt for more points, so I'm a little sad that it's gone. Although I will note that the stats that were used to tally up one's BK are still intact. I can still see the number of rates/reviews I have, the number of beers and photos I've added, number of comments and likes, and so on, so really the achievements aren't gone--just the system that artificially equalizes all those things into a point system.

So I suppose my vote would be for the return of Beer Karma, but I agree with others who have suggested some alterations to how it is calculated. Things that really help make this site a useful resource should be credited--of course the reviews and ratings that make up the score database, but also things like photos, beer corrections and adds (if validated) and event adds. Likes should still receive credit, as community is an important part of the site as well, but it does feel like there are a couple ways on the site you can get huge like totals without really putting much effort or thoughtfulness into your contribution.

Disclaimer: there is absolutely nothing wrong with people sharing their beverage and/or latest haul and getting likes for it. There's nothing wrong whatsoever with mindless fun--after all, this is a site about beer, and drinking and getting beer in the mail are two really fun parts of beer. But you have to acknowledge that it takes less time and thought to post a picture of your beer/haul than it does to craft an opinion about some issue facing craft beer today. Admittedly, I'm biased, because I tend to gravitate more towards the discussion threads than the photo threads, but just wanted to share that perspective.

On a stats-related, but not BK-related note: I'd love to see more advanced stats on my user profile--things like a listing of the styles I've had, or the states/countries from which I've had beers, etc.

 

I guess I am lucky that I have never seen that on here. Maybe I am not going to the right threads or having the right conversations.

Really, the only time I have seen anything similar is OPs that tag their questions with "sorry for the newbie question..." or something along those lines. The people responding to these posts seem to mostly be friendly and humble in my experience.

 

Dude. Nothing is gone. Everything you did to reach that status level is still there. And while I can understand some frustration about losing something you worked for, let's not get carried away. You've posed a lot of ratings and a lot of comments in WBAYDN. That's not some huge undertaking. And you've still got all your likes and all your ratings.

I mean, based on the parts of your last comment that I bolded/underlined, I think some perspective is sorely needed.

I'm not condoning the ridiculous date shaming that I too have seen take place on the site, but I will argue that Joined Date is useful. Beer Advocate has been around for over a decade and gone through a lot of changes, iterations, evolutions, etc. People who have newer join dates may not be noobs to the beer world, but their join date is likely a decent indicator of how new they are to this particular site and it's history/culture. Case in point: @beertunes' story about old Beer Karma.

And as far as I'm concerned, if Beer Karma is useful, entertaining, valuable, etc on some level, then Joined Date is valuable for basically the same reasons. Neither is fair to use as a surrogate indicator for someone's knowledge level, but they are fun to have and know.

 

Have to agree that, although it was a bit geeky, it was fun and I was motivated to post more and try new things because of it. I also loved the fact that it identified folks as to their time and expertise (well supposed), and it was a reward of sorts for time spent and participation in the forums. Please bring it back. It was and should still be an integral part of the site!

 

For what its worth, I too enjoyed the idea of the beer karma system. Having only recently joined the site, I found the beer karma system to be a helpful way of introducing me to the flow and culture of the site. This is important as it helps soften the perceived elitness of sites like this. It helps build your confidence towards becoming an active member, if you so choose.

If the concern is people misrepresenting themselves, I don't see any resolution as no matter what the system, people will find ways to exploit it. I suppose you could make the score private but that would take away from the social aspect of the site and people's general fun. Besides, as many have already implied, no one seems to take the number all that serious (I mean its not a FICO score).

I can appreciate the gravity if its a severe technical issue/burden. Hopefully a little coding elbow grease can address that.

Assuming you have the resources to devote to this facet, I feel it would be well worth the effort to keep the fun factor in addition to being a helpful guide to new comers like me.

 

Bring it back or some replacement enhanced system. It was fun.