Dry hopping Pale Ale

Discussion in 'Homebrewing' started by lordofthelambics, Dec 1, 2014.

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  1. lordofthelambics

    lordofthelambics Initiate (0) Feb 14, 2014 Washington

    http://embracethefunk.com/2012/11/2...beers-qa-with-chad-yakobson-of-crooked-stave/

    A lot of late hops. The late hops really accentuate the beer…and again more dry hopping. Don’t be afraid to use a decent amount of hops. We are using anywhere from 2 to 4 pounds per barrel. In the black IPA I went a little lighter using 2 pounds per barrel so for homebrewers we are looking at half a pound to 1 pound per carboy. A 1/3rd of that for late hopping and 2/3rd for dry hopping, it’s something you can play around with even doing half in late and half in dry hopping. Both those should work pretty well.
    ​
    Assuming Chad is talking about a standard 5 gallon carboy, that's a strong dry hopping.

    I've got a Mosaic pale ale that I just brewed over the weekend. 5.5 gallons. I was planning on a two-stage dry hop with 1.5oz of pellets each time. After reading that article, I'm thinking that's obviously not enough if I want an aromatic pale.

    Out here, Mosaic hops are $2.99/oz. If I wanted to do a double dry hop, that'd cost me $50+/each (again, assuming he's talking about 1/2-1lb for each dry hop -- I could be misunderstanding). Not happening, even if it's a total amount.

    I wanted this to be a SMaSH pale, but I'm willing to change the game plan.

    First, I'm looking for some insight into how much hops I should be using for dry hopping. Would a double 1.5oz dry hop (5 days each) be enough? My feeling is no, but what are your thoughts? How much should I be using?

    Secondly, if I wanted a (significantly cheaper) hop to complement the aromatic profile of Mosaic, what should I be looking at? Ideally something that would be in the $10-15/lb range.

    Cheers!
    -C
     
    #1 lordofthelambics, Dec 1, 2014
  2. drewbeerme

    drewbeerme Initiate (0) Nov 16, 2007 Illinois

    You should post your recipe and process. Bottle conditioning or kegging? .5oz-2oz should be plenty. Although in my experience bottle conditioning is not a good way to end up with a very hoppy aromatic beer. The cheaper C hops should complement well (chinook, cascade, Columbus).
     
    #2 drewbeerme, Dec 1, 2014
  3. lordofthelambics

    lordofthelambics Initiate (0) Feb 14, 2014 Washington

    Good point. That's kind of important. Straight from bucket to keg, where I'll be dry hopping/force-carbing. No bottling.

    Wort Volume Before Boil:
    7.00 US gals

    Wort Volume After Boil:
    5.75 US gals

    Volume Transferred:
    5.75 US gals

    Volume At Pitching:
    5.75 US gals

    Volume Of Finished Beer:
    5.00 US gals

    Expected Pre-Boil Gravity:
    1.041 SG

    Expected OG:
    1.050 SG

    Expected FG:
    1.012 SG

    Apparent Attenuation:
    75.0 %

    Expected ABV:
    5.0 %

    Expected ABW:
    4.0 %

    Expected IBU: (using Tinseth):
    44.7 IBU

    Mash Efficiency:
    65.0 %

    Boil Duration:
    60.0 mins

    Fermentation Temperature:
    65 ˚F

    Ingredient
    UK Pale Ale Malt
    12lb 0oz

    Current hop schedule:
    Variety Alpha Amount IBU Form When
    US Mosaic 12.5 % 1.50 oz 40.6 Loose Pellet Hops 20 Min From End
    US Mosaic 12.5 % 0.20 oz 3.2 Loose Pellet Hops 10 Min From End
    US Mosaic 12.5 % 0.10 oz 0.9 Loose Pellet Hops 5 Min From End
    US Mosaic 12.5 % 1.50 oz 0.0 Loose Pellet Hops (Whirlpool - held at 180 degrees for 15 minutes)
    US Mosaic 12.5 % 1.50 oz 0.0 Bagged Pellet Hops Dry-Hopped
    US Mosaic 12.5 % 1.50 oz 0.0 Bagged Pellet Hops Dry-Hopped

    Thanks!
     
    #3 lordofthelambics, Dec 1, 2014
  4. jlordi12

    jlordi12 Pooh-Bah (1,856) Jun 8, 2011 Massachusetts
    Pooh-Bah

    I've made a few beers recently where I hopped only from 20-30 minutes and they were missing something. Put me in the camp that says that 60 minute brings an important element to a PA/IPA/IIPA
     
    #4 jlordi12, Dec 1, 2014
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  5. ipas-for-life

    ipas-for-life Savant (1,041) Feb 28, 2012 Virginia

    I personally think the amount you plan on using is fine for a pale ale. I usually use 2-4 oz for 5 days for my ipas and get plenty of aroma. If anything I would maybe add 1 more oz and use 2oz for each dry hop. But I'm not sure that would make much of a difference.

    Also consider buying bulk hops if you brew regularly. I ordered from a place in Washington and Mosaic is $13 for 1/2 and $22 for 1 LB and that is one of the most expensive hops available. You can get Columbus from the same place for $10 a LB. The money I saved this year buying in bulk paid for a nice vacuum sealer plus some. And not only do you save money but you also know you are getting fresh hops. I guarantee you a lot of homebrew stores are still selling 2013 hops.
     
    #5 ipas-for-life, Dec 1, 2014
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  6. telejunkie

    telejunkie Savant (1,107) Sep 14, 2007 Vermont

    math isn't quite working here...2-4# per barrel (31 gallons) equals out to 5-10 oz per 5 gallons. Saying 2/3 goes into dry hops, that equates out to 3.3-6.6 oz for dry hops. That seems a little on the high end, but within range...

    Here was a recent pale ale I did with mosaic in a two-stage mix. I realize not quite what you're looking for, but turned out great although would agree with jlordi12 and add a touch of hops at 60min:
    https://byo.com/stories/issue/item/3166-astronomical-american-pale

    I'm another one buying bulk and vacuum sealing...so much cheaper in the long run. Subbing out for Mosaic will just lead to other expensive hops like Galaxy.
     
    #6 telejunkie, Dec 1, 2014
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  7. lordofthelambics

    lordofthelambics Initiate (0) Feb 14, 2014 Washington

    Would you mind sharing your source, please. I'd love to order from them if possible.
     
    #7 lordofthelambics, Dec 1, 2014
  8. drewbeerme

    drewbeerme Initiate (0) Nov 16, 2007 Illinois

    In my experience 2 separate dry hop additions aren't really necessary especially in a keg where you can move it around a little (I rock my kegs a few times a day during the dry hopping). Also, I think Mosaic does better with a more traditional schedule of hopping. It can also get onion/garlic when hopped late and big dry hop. Since you already made the beer I'd go with 1-2oz of Mosaic for 5-7 days. Remove hop sack, crash, and carb. Should be drinking good after 1-2 weeks or once it has dropped bright.
     
    #8 drewbeerme, Dec 1, 2014
  9. PortLargo

    PortLargo Pooh-Bah (1,831) Oct 19, 2012 Florida
    Pooh-Bah

    After my first IIPA I started ordering hops in bulk. The domestic 2014 crop is just now available, foreign hops probably in a month or so. My supplier is Yakima Valley and as noted by @ipas-for-life, the price is just over a buck an ounce when you load up. Of course you need to clean out a shelf in your freezer and probably buy a foodsaver . . . but hey, if you want admittance to the Hop-Head Club you have to pay some dues.

    Reference dry hopping: For 5 gals I regularly use 4 ounces, usually split in two batches over a 12-14 day period. Flame out hops are usually in the 2-4 ounce range.


    Purge that thought . . . we're talkin' beer here. Mosiac is in high demand because it's good and the price reflects that. The last thing to consider is price of hops . . . Michelangelo didn't paint the Sistine Chapel by going cheap. You want an omelette? You gotta break some eggs.
     
    #9 PortLargo, Dec 1, 2014
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  10. billandsuz

    billandsuz Pooh-Bah (2,097) Sep 1, 2004 New York
    Pooh-Bah

    my advice is to forget about what the pro's are doing in this instance. there are many variables that do not directly scale from multi barrel systems to 1/6 barrel systems. for one, if you plan to add a massive amount of late addition kettle hops you may as well kiss a lot of your brew goodbye. more than a few pints will be locked up in vegetative green matter. and of course advising brewers to use X amount of hops is pointless without knowing the hop variety, not to mention the grain bill.

    a few ounces of dry hops is really what is needed. 4 to 6 ounces in the keg is a shit ton. if you want to be a rebel go with 6 to 8.
    Cascade or Centennial work very well and are relatively cheap. like Largo said, if you want to go big with the fancy stuff then open your wallet. but any of the C hops have been providing great dry hop aroma for years. decades even.
    Cheers.
     
    #10 billandsuz, Dec 1, 2014
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  11. ipas-for-life

    ipas-for-life Savant (1,041) Feb 28, 2012 Virginia

    #11 ipas-for-life, Dec 2, 2014
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