First wit this weekend, any suggestions?

Discussion in 'Homebrewing' started by JimmyTango, Oct 9, 2012.

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  1. JimmyTango

    JimmyTango Initiate (0) Aug 1, 2011 California

    I'll be brewing up my first Wit this weekend, but I was hoping for some feedback form y'all first...

    Will a single infusion at 152 do the trick? It'll be 4# 2-row, 4# flaked Wheat, 1# rolled oats. OG1.045

    I'll be spicing it with sweet orange peel, clove, and maybe some vanilla and maybe cinamon (going for somehting nice and wintery). Suggestions on how much of each? I also have some grains of paradise... will they add to the orangey-ness?

    Looking for a thick, slightly sweet, winter-spiced, easy sipping wit. Planning on using WLP400 at 66F.

    Any thoughts or tips are greatly appreciated. Thanks!
     
  2. barfdiggs

    barfdiggs Initiate (0) Mar 22, 2011 California

    Drop the cloves, it'll be weird. You'll get some spicy phenolics from the yeast and from any late hop additions if you choose to do them, which would clash with cloves.

    Coriander (indian variety) will give you some citrus/fruit loops flavors if desired, and sweet orange peel contributes some sweet fruitiness. Grains of paradise are very spicy, and when I've used them, I added with great moderation (1/2 tsp). Vanilla and cinnamon might be a fun addition, although not quite sure how they'll work with other additions, but since part of making wits is spicing the way you'd like, so feel free to go for it.

    I've mashed anywhere from 148-152, and had the beers come out nice and attenuated. You dont' want a super thick, flabby beer with a wit, and you'll get a lot in the mouthfeel & body department from the flaked oats and flaked wheat, so 152 is probably my personal upper limit.

    Be prepared for an everlasting krausen with WLP400. It just sticks around for days, even after primary fermentation is complete. I've had the FG stabilize in 7-8 days, but had the krausen stay for 3-4 weeks (On my second, third, etc. wits I've just racked out underneath it after 14 days).
     
  3. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,375) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Society Pooh-Bah

    You might want to read this recent thread: http://beeradvocate.com/community/threads/question-on-belgian-witbier-recipe-please-help.41907/#post-527663

    To reply to your questions:

    I have conducted single infusion at 150°F with a 50/50 mix of Belgian Pilsner and Flaked Wheat. That has worked well for me; your infusion temperature of 152°F should be just fine. I would suggest that you use Pilsner malt vs. 2-row but 2-row should ‘work’ too.

    I have only spiced my Wits using coriander and curacao orange peel so I can’t help you with your spicing amounts.

    I have used Wyeast 3944 for my wits; WLP400 is the equivalent of 3944. I have always fermented in the 70-72°F range to ‘encourage’ some more Belgiany character: more esters (fruity flavors) and phenols (spicy flavors).

    I have never brewed with grains of paradise; it is my understanding that this spice provides a peppery/spicy flavor.

    I obtain a citrus flavor/aroma from the freshly ground coriander. Curacao orange peel provides a flavor/aroma with an herbal character; it is similar to chamomile to my palate.

    Good luck with your Wit.

    Cheers!
     
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  4. JimmyTango

    JimmyTango Initiate (0) Aug 1, 2011 California

    Awesome. Thanks for the feedback.

    Cloves are out; cinamon, vanilla, and orange peel are in. NO late hops.

    I also have a cake of WLP500 that I could put this on instead of the WLP400. Kinda feel like the Chimay in the low 60's could be a nicer choice for a smoother, spicier, "winterier" beer.

    EDIT: Thanks Jack nand Barf! You guys are always on point with theses threads.
     
  5. JimmyTango

    JimmyTango Initiate (0) Aug 1, 2011 California

    Oops, I just checked my "cart" and realized that I bought .5oz of bitter orange peel.

    Does .5oz at f/o sound appropriate? Should I pick up some more before the weekend?

    Also, anybody have any feedback on using cinamon? I figure I can't really over-do the vanilla, but I'm not quite sure how to handle the cinamon. 2 sticks at f/o?
     
  6. barfdiggs

    barfdiggs Initiate (0) Mar 22, 2011 California

    That sounds around right. I can't remember if I use 0.5 or 1 oz (Can check when home)... 1 cinnamon stick & 1 vanilla bean should do it. If not enough, you can always make a cinnamon, vanilla etc. tincture to add at kegging or to your bottling bucket to get the right amount of spice/vanilla.

    I add all my spices with 2 min left in the boil in a muslin bag and let them steep for the duration of my whirlpool (10 min) before pulling them out and chilling. I like my spices (Sweet & Bitter orange peel, coriander, grains of paradise and super fresh chamomile are what I use) in the background and not overwhelming.

    EDIT: Pils is more traditional for a wit, however I've made some with NA Pale Malt that were good, just a little more full but lacking the nice cracker/graininess of Pils malt
     
  7. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,375) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Society Pooh-Bah

    “Does .5oz at f/o sound appropriate? Should I pick up some more before the weekend?”

    My standard practice for adding curacao orange peel to my Wit beers is ½ oz. for the last 20 minutes of boil. I don’t think you need more than ½ oz. of curacao orange peel. When you add the spices is a matter of personal preference. I have always been happy with the results of 20 minutes of boiling. You can add them at flameout as well; I don’t have any personal experience here so I can’t discuss the effects of varying the addition time.

    I have zero experience with using vanilla or cinnamon so I can’t opine on that topic. I wonder how those flavors will interact with the flavors provided by coriander, curacao orange peel and the yeast induced flavors. They may complement or they may clash.

    Cheers!

    P.S. I do place my curacao orange peel in a muslin bag. I just add the freshly ground coriander to the boiling wort. I don’t whirlpool and I don’t remove the curacao orange peel; it gets dumped into the fermenter along with the cooled wort.

    I also agree that all of the spicing should be subtle; for instance I only use 1 tablespoon of coriander (this weighs less than 0.2 ounces).
     
  8. JimmyTango

    JimmyTango Initiate (0) Aug 1, 2011 California

    I'm not planning on using any coriander, which I know is straying from convention but whatev.

    Still on the fence with the grains of paradise. Probably going to hold off on them if I go froward with the cinamon and vanilla.
     
  9. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,375) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Society Pooh-Bah

    “I'm not planning on using any coriander, which I know is straying from convention…” Ah, the beauty of homebrewing: make the beer you like and make it the way you like!:slight_smile:

    Good luck with your Jimmy Wit and please report back how it turned out.

    Cheers!
     
  10. inchrisin

    inchrisin Pooh-Bah (2,013) Sep 25, 2008 Indiana
    Pooh-Bah

    I'll pull you in another direction, Jimmy T. I would personally drop the vanilla. I don't want to drink a creamsickle beer. Maybe that's just me. In moderation this might be tasty. As said above, coriander can be a nice addition and can really help add another dimension of citrus. Beyond that I'd also consider adding fresh nutmeg. Maybe not for a summer beer, but for the winter it might be tasty.

    All that said, you can make some extracts with vodka and let them soak for a few days while you ferment. If you like a flavor combo that you like with vanilla, coriander, nutmeg, grains of paradise, etc. feel free to add it at the end of primary. Get a sample of beer in a 4 oz glass and feel free to spice that too.
     
  11. JimmyTango

    JimmyTango Initiate (0) Aug 1, 2011 California

    Hmmm... Nutmeg sounds perty good. Probably have to go super light on that one though.

    And I have no problem drinking a creamsickle beer : )
     
  12. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,375) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Society Pooh-Bah

    “And I have no problem drinking a creamsickle beer” I don’t think I would mind drinking one creamsickle beer but I doubt that I would want two cases worth.

    The beer that is coming to mind with this creamsickle discussion is Southern Tier Crème Brulee Stout. I had this beer once on draft in a small snifter. When I finished that glass (9 ounces?), I personally had enough and I had zero interest in drinking another.

    Below is an interesting description of this beer from http://thefullpint.com/beer-reviews/southern-tier-creme-brulee-stout/

    “Southern Tier Brewing – Southern Tier Creme Brulee Stout - 22 oz bottle poured into a goblet. 9.2% abv. Purchased at Monster Beverage in Glassboro, NJ

    Appearance: Pours a dark brown with a decent dense tan foamy head.

    Aroma: Butterscotch candy and or butterscotch ice cream syrup.

    Taste: Butterscotch, vanilla, roasted malt, and finishes with a slight bitterness.

    Mouthfeel: Full bodied and slightly sticky.

    Overall: If you picked up this beer hoping for something that tastes like creme brulee, you wouldn’t be dissapointed. This beer is just too sweet for me to want to drink more than a half a glass.”

    Cheers!
     
  13. Naugled

    Naugled Pooh-Bah (1,944) Sep 25, 2007 New York
    Pooh-Bah

    I'd ferment that yeast at least in the 70's. Even at that temp it only throws off subtle pepper phenolics. By the sounds of it, you are looking for a spice component. I've fermented that yeast up to 80F with ok results, 75F seems to be the limit for my tastes though.
     
  14. JimmyTango

    JimmyTango Initiate (0) Aug 1, 2011 California

    Thanks for the comments doods.

    I quite enjoyed the Boont Summer Solstice this year, and I'm pretty sure it had a heavy hand of vanilla thrown in.... but I'm not really dedicated to the creamsickle thing.

    I'm starting to get more dedicated to the grains of paradise idea, but I'm not sure how they'll work with vanilla (if I go that route). Right now I think I'm at a fork in the road; WLP400 in the low 70's with orange peel and vanilla in one direction, or WLP500 in the high 60s with orange peel and grains of paradise.

    Maybe I'll make my wife make the call.
     
  15. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,375) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Society Pooh-Bah


    You can always flip a quarter!?!:slight_smile:

    Cheers!
     
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