German craft beer

Discussion in 'Germany' started by einhorn, Dec 20, 2012.

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  1. einhorn

    einhorn Savant (1,175) Nov 3, 2005 California

    I am not 100% correct, but I believe that CO2 from non-fermenting source is also allowed. IIRC the brewers were against this mostly for practical reasons, as there is no chemical difference in CO2 coming from beer or otherwise.
     
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  2. herrburgess

    herrburgess Grand Pooh-Bah (3,077) Nov 4, 2009 South Carolina
    Pooh-Bah

    I don't think it's a matter of chemical difference, but rather that forced carbonation scrubs SO2, which many German brewers tend to prize and/or cultivate by various methods.

    Also, I'm pretty sure the CO2 -- forced or retained -- has to be naturally produced from fermentation to be used according to the RHG.
     
  3. patto1ro

    patto1ro Pooh-Bah (2,084) Apr 26, 2004 Netherlands
    Pooh-Bah

    If I were lucky eough to own a German brewery, I'd open ferment, lager for 1 week per degree Plato, and bung. Not filter and serve only Bayerische Anstich. I'd probably go bankrupt, but I'd be doing it the way I think is best.

    http://barclayperkins.blogspot.nl/2013/10/natural-vs-artificial-co2.html
     
  4. steveh

    steveh Grand Pooh-Bah (4,174) Oct 8, 2003 Illinois
    Society Pooh-Bah

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  5. Gutes_Bier

    Gutes_Bier Maven (1,363) Jul 31, 2011 Germany

    Went to the store today and found a new Paulaner product: Braumeister Edition Münchner Revoluzzer. It's appears to be an attempt to capitalize on the "Craft" movement, so I figured I'd do the pre-tasting write-up here and then put the review in the Bayern Biere thread. Not super surprised to see Paulaner put out such a product, they are behind the Brauerei Im Eiswerk project if I remember correctly?

    On the front of the label they quote the head braumeister, who calls this an homage to the original revolutionary (Revoluzzer?) that was the Munich Helles, and something about making an "ursprunchliche" (original) recipe in his own way (with a twist!? oh no!!!!). A more cynical man than I would be surprised at how many big brewers seem to be finding original recipes in their attics of late.

    Lots of interesting wording on the back label including "23 Bittereinhelten" (23 IBU's presumably?) and some spiel about this being "einmalig gebraut" (brewed once) and "streng limitiert" (strongly limited). These promises seem to be contradicted by the "Edition No. 01" (so it will be brewed again?) and the multitude of cases I saw at my local Kaufland. Anyway. 12.5% Stammwürze, 5.5% ABV. Cold-hopped with Saaz. They call it a Spezial and describe it as malty to start, with a creamy-soft mouthfeel, and rounded out by a bitter finish. This is all translated to the best of my abilities from the label, entirely in German. Give me a bit of a +/- on the accuracy.

    €0,84 per 500 ml bottle. Best before June 2014, a six month best by. That should be a good sign, right? Full report later tonight if I can.
     
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  6. steveh

    steveh Grand Pooh-Bah (4,174) Oct 8, 2003 Illinois
    Society Pooh-Bah

    Oh great, Tickers rejoice.

    Cold hopped? :astonished:
     
  7. herrburgess

    herrburgess Grand Pooh-Bah (3,077) Nov 4, 2009 South Carolina
    Pooh-Bah

    Said it before: careful what you ask for....

    EDIT: of course if you were to add 60 or so IBUs to it, even the seemingly level-headed folks would probably start clamoring for it and heaping on the praise.
     
  8. Gutes_Bier

    Gutes_Bier Maven (1,363) Jul 31, 2011 Germany

    The website has more, but if you click on the English Language (GB flag) you are taken off this page for some reason.

    http://www.paulaner-brauerei.de/794.0.html?ac=1

    They say it's also referred to has "Hopfenstopfung", done to preserve the aroma of the hops that are lost in the cooking (boiling) process. Is this dry hopping do we think?
     
  9. herrburgess

    herrburgess Grand Pooh-Bah (3,077) Nov 4, 2009 South Carolina
    Pooh-Bah

    Yes, "Hopfenstopfen" is dry-hopping.

    Ooh..."und eine leichte Hefetrübung."

    Unfiltered Helles, dry-hopped with Saaz...the natives are going to get very restless now!

    Again, however, they're missing the true draw for U.S.-style "craft" beer fans: MOAR HOPS!!!!!!!
     
  10. Gutes_Bier

    Gutes_Bier Maven (1,363) Jul 31, 2011 Germany

    I'm really looking forward to trying it, which is funny because Paulaner's Helles is probably my least favorite of the Münchner brewed Helles. I give them credit if nothing else for getting an €0,84 bottle to the market. A lot of these get the 750ml, caged & corked, €11,00 per bottle treatment.
     
  11. herrburgess

    herrburgess Grand Pooh-Bah (3,077) Nov 4, 2009 South Carolina
    Pooh-Bah

    Yea, if the beer geeks here didn't write it off on the low IBUs, they probably would on price.

    But it sounds like the marketing is working: Paulaner makes one of the worst-crafted Helles among the Munich Big 6; but leave some yeast in suspension and add some dry-hops and "boom," people are suddenly more interested in it than in Augustiner. (Not singling you out specifically, because my interest is slightly piqued, too.)

    Anyhow, I'm pretty sure I'm entering the 4th stage of grief on the whole "craft" thing. Just the thought of IBUs is starting to make me depressed.
     
    #331 herrburgess, Dec 4, 2013
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2013
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  12. herrburgess

    herrburgess Grand Pooh-Bah (3,077) Nov 4, 2009 South Carolina
    Pooh-Bah

    ...guess this now makes Paulaner "innovative" and Augustiner "boring."
     
  13. Gutes_Bier

    Gutes_Bier Maven (1,363) Jul 31, 2011 Germany

    Jeez I leave my computer for two seconds and get accused of hating on Augustiner!?:wink:

    Actually it's funny you mention them, because I seriously debated picking up an Edelstoff to do a blind side-by-side. What I decided on, though, was to judge this one alone on it's relative merits and save the comparison to Augustiner for some other time.

    And to be fair, I never said it was or wasn't more interesting than Augustiner or anything else. I just picked it up because it was new and looked interesting in the "Craft In Germany" context.
     
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  14. herrburgess

    herrburgess Grand Pooh-Bah (3,077) Nov 4, 2009 South Carolina
    Pooh-Bah

    Didn't mean to single you out or put words in your mouth. Apologies if it came off that way.

    What depresses me is that it's the same thing that has been happening here year upon year upon year: inferior/poorly crafted base beers adding the same "twists" as everyone else (i.e., unfiltered, more hops, hype about being "limited") and *still* garnering attention for it despite the fact that better crafted beers surround such "innovations."

    Just not sure I can take much more of this. But whatever...I'm probably just in a personal funk, so please feel free to ignore.

    Or, if you like, have a read of this from the WSJ: Peanut Butter Pop-Tarts touted as "innovation" http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702304854804579236601411310502

    (hat-tip to SteveH for the link)
     
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  15. Gutes_Bier

    Gutes_Bier Maven (1,363) Jul 31, 2011 Germany

    It's all good, I just wanted to make sure I wasn't giving off a false impression.
     
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  16. herrburgess

    herrburgess Grand Pooh-Bah (3,077) Nov 4, 2009 South Carolina
    Pooh-Bah

    Not at all. It just all hit home for me with this example. Again, sorry if I seemed to single you out...and I'm still interested to hear your thoughts on the beer. Maybe unfiltering, adding hops, and hyping it up really is all it takes to make a good "craft" beer out of a mediocre one. :wink:
     
    #336 herrburgess, Dec 4, 2013
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2013
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  17. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,375) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Society Pooh-Bah

    “What depresses me is that it's the same thing that has been happening here year upon year upon year: inferior/poorly crafted base beers…”

    I am assuming “here” means the US. I do not see things that way at all. There are plenty of high quality US craft beers being made (I am uncertain what the word “base” refers to). I had the pleasure of attending a Firestone Walker event at a local beer bar and even had a chance to chat with David Walker for 10-15 minutes (we discussed many brewing topics). I drank a Velvet Merlin (Oatmeal Stout), Velvet Merkin (barrel aged Imperial Oatmeal Stout), Wookey Jack (Black IPA; that is how David Walker describes this beer) and a Union Jack (IPA). All of those beers were of high quality and nothing inferior of poorly crafted about them.

    I would expect that some folks might think a barrel aged Imperial Oatmeal Stout or a Black IPA are “twisted” beers but to me they are high quality craft beers that are an extreme joy to drink.

    Cheers!
     
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  18. herrburgess

    herrburgess Grand Pooh-Bah (3,077) Nov 4, 2009 South Carolina
    Pooh-Bah

    FW is a good example. But you really hammered your point home (to me at least) with the assertion that Sly Fox Rauchbier is the qualitative equal of Schlenkerla. I get it now...I really do.
     
    #338 herrburgess, Dec 4, 2013
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2013
  19. steveh

    steveh Grand Pooh-Bah (4,174) Oct 8, 2003 Illinois
    Society Pooh-Bah

    I don't think you're happy enough! That's right! I'll teach you to be happy! I'll teach your grandmother to suck eggs! Now, boys and girls, let's try it again!

    :grinning:
     
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  20. Bierman9

    Bierman9 Grand Pooh-Bah (5,313) Dec 20, 2001 New Hampshire
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    I thought it was MOHR hops in Deutschland?!

    Prosit!!
     
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