Help me understand my induction options

My 2 cents Sir, sorry I can not help you.

http://www.doityourself.com/forum/electrical-ac-dc-9/

 

At 120 volts, your 1800W burner draws 15 amps. That is what most residential receptacles are rated at, as is the breaker feeding it. Some you will find are rated at 20 amps but are usually dedicated circuits, meaning that is the only outlet on the circuit breaker. You will find that your receptacles are ganged together in your house or apartment on one 15 amp breaker because the engineering electrical code assumes you will not have but one lamp, radio, toaster, or other low amperage device operating at a time.

I have a 25 gallon boil kettle and a 30# propane bottle lasts through three brewing cycles, however I do have three of them just in case.

Now to address your child and dog issue. Teach your child that fire is hot, and don't let them play around when you brew. Same goes for the dog. Many of us have small children and pets and still seem to brew without incident...

 

You are understanding pretty well.

Ohms law is Power = Voltage x Current

So for 120 V and 15 Amps the max power is 120 x 15 = 1800 Watts.

I agree that it would be prudent to not operate this circuit at max amps continuously.

Cheers!

 

I think you will find even an 1800 watt burner is not adequate for brewing. I had one of these http://www.amazon.com/NuWave-Highes...UTF8&qid=1460913652&sr=8-9&keywords=induction, and it took hours to bring 5 gallons to a boil, and once the lid was removed it couldn't maintain the boil (you should get similar results for 4 gallons in an 8 gallon pot). If you search some of the homebrew sites for induction eventually you will find poeple saying the use this http://www.webstaurantstore.com/ava...ooker-208-240v-3500w/177IC3500 208*240.html with good success. I am one of those people. It still takes longer to boil than I would like, may 30-45 minutes to boil ~6 gallons after mashing. I find that trade off acceptable given that I don't use propane for anything else, I didn't want to have to deal with the tanks, or running out, or having to refill them. I also am comfortable using an induction burner in my garage, right under the bedrooms, where I probably wouldn't be with a propane burner. With this set up I can brew "outside" (i.e. not in conditioned space) in the summer, but also not be exposed to the elements if it rains or there is a -30 degree windchill. All that said, you are still dealing with a few gallons of boiling liquid, and even though you don't have an open flame, it is hot, and it really isn't safe for a child or dog to be playing near it.

While my house is not old, I also didn't have an available 240 line to use. For me the solution was to install a 240 line the garage. Its not all that difficult, and the most expensive part was the wire, I did it myself for $50 all in (probably could have done it for half that if I used shorter wiring, and had the outlet near the breaker box). If you aren't comfortable with doing that, I would think an electrician could do it for a reasonable amount ($200?) assuming your breaker box is in reasonable shape (you need two breaker slots in the box for a 240 line), and somewhat close to where you want to brew. If the electric looks like the 100+ year old house I grew up in, an electrician may not want to touch it without upgrading your box, that will be much more expensive.

 

The probability of burning your house down by drawing too much juice is very low . . . what will happen is your breaker will trip (as designed) leaving you to figure out what when wrong. It's not uncommon while doing maintenance to short out a circuit which tries to draw an infinite current, but if Mr. CB is on the job there are usually no consequences (other than a few sparks and maybe falling off the ladder). There is no 80% factor on a continuous circuit, it either works or it doesn't. That said, you really shouldn't push the absolute limit (i.e. 1800W on a 15 amp circuit) because any tiny variance (heat, increased resistance, older CB) will trip the circuit.

This is unlikely (but not impossible). Usually areas spread out like this are on multiple circuits. It's easy to check: just trip the breaker and start plugging a lamp into all the outlets, you'll quickly see where the circuits run.

Power sticks are good, at 1000W you are pulling just under 9 amps which is okay on a 15 amp circuit. Any simple 16 gauge extension cord is rated for 10-15 amps (depends on length) . . . I wouldn't be afraid to use that combination. If really nervous use a 14 gauge cord ($20) which handles 15 amps at 50'.

My recommendation is to go propane because real brewers use a hot flame:

If determined to use electricity I would take @redmaw advice and add a 220 circuit. It's not terribly difficult for an electrician and when you sell the house you'll get the money back. Another work-around if you use tap-water for brewing (I do) is to draw your strike/sparge water from your hot water heater . . . start the boil at ~120° instead of using cold inlet water. What's the other Forum where no one understands electric brewing?

EDIT: Just noticed this: my gas range/oven
If you have natural gas available you have no problem. Spend whatever it takes to stub a NG line to your brew station and you'll be in the big leagues . . . we can even have the Moderator give you an extra 50 karma points .

 

1800 watts is the equivalent of 6,100 btu/hr. To compare a modest residential stove top will have one burner that can produce about 12,000 btu. The maximum is limited to about 18,000 btu because it is difficult to remove all the heat from a home without a commercial hood. There is also the issue of a very big flame in a flammable kitchen. 18,000 btu is 5,300 watts.

A Cajun Cooker style propane burner, used by most home brewers, will produce 60,000 btu and maybe as much as 130,000 btu or more. @mikehartigan 's burner produces what Mike? 1 billion BTU?

6,100 btu just is not going to cut it for anything but the smallest boil volume.
Your 120 volt circuit is limiting. Most residential wiring is 14 gauge and this corresponds to 15 amp maximum draw. You may be lucky and have 12 gauge which would allow up to 20 amp draw but that is hardly the solution.

So, if you have your heart set on an electric boiler, hire an electrician and plan to spend a thousand to install a dedicated 240V circuit. Assuming your panel has capacity.

You need a propane or gas powered burner though.
Cheers.

 

The only easy solution you seem to be overlooking is just getting a propane burner to use outside. An induction system of any sort is not going to make multiple gallons of boiling wort safer for you, your children, or your pets. But a simple propane burner gives you the flexibility to set up in any of several possible safe locations when you brew. A dedicated, high capacity electrical system will not give you that flexibility, and you will still have to maintain a safe space around where you work, regardless.

 

Can't help with the induction question, but my limited reading makes me think that full boils (5 gallon batches) requires 240v for induction burners. I think @PortLargo has the answer, figure out how to get your gas line outside and use that. It will be a lot cheaper (and quicker/easier) in the end. Or figure out how to run a 240 line from your panel to your brew space and then deal with the induction burner question.

 

I had a pool installed and found out I needed another 240 for some of the pumps, was in a bind and going to have to replace my outside Breaker box with a new one, not a big fan on doing that, so I gave up my 240 dryer and switched to gas (had a gas outlet there). So my suggestion is if you have a 240 in your utility room, unplug the dryer and get the larger induction burner that @redmaw references above in his post.

 

so the main issue is the heat/steam coming off of the wort in the kitchen? Not sure what the temperature is like where you live in the summer, but if you aren't running an AC, what you could do is open a window in the next closest room to the kitchen, then open a window in the kitchen and put a box fan in front of it where it is sucking the air from the house in and pushing it out. What that will do is create a flow from the other room and pull a good portion of the steam thru the box fan.

 

FWIW, I brew inside on a gas cooktop. Don't know my BTUs, but it does a respectable job. It takes less than 20 minutes for my strike water (~120 up to 160'ish) and about the same time from my last lautering until the brew kettle is boiling (typically 7 gal). Yes the kitchen gets hot . . . but you know the old saying. I would still do cartwheels if there was natural gas available to me.

 

IMO - Brewing outside of your house is probably the best option. For water damage mitigation, wear and tear on kitchen, etc.

Also IMO - I know very little about brewing so far as I am new on this adventure.

Also also - Lengthening your natural gas line is not that difficult, and could easily be done if you have the tools, or a friend that does/handyman. HOWEVER - Depending on the city, state, etc - You have an old house, and a lot of time when you look to get a permit for something (like augmenting your NG line if you are required to do so) the inspectors find other issues - and you have no choice but to fix said issues to comply to new code, avoid negligence, yada yada. So, weigh the pros and cons! Hopefully you live outside of the city/HOA anyway

 

Natural gas is a no-brainer. If you're any kind of a DIYer, you can do it yourself using off the shelf parts from whatever passes for a Home Depot in your neighborhood. It won't take more than a few batches to pay for the upgrade in fuel cost savings over propane or electricity - while the price varies, NG typically costs 85-90% less than propane in my neck of the woods, and I believe electricity is probably in the same ballpark as propane, though I haven't done the Math. @WertMaker said a 30# tank of propane lasts three batches. Assuming that's true (I'm not saying it's not, but that sounds like an awful lot of gas), then that's about $10/batch for fuel alone, given the prevailing price for propane in my area (say "prevailing price for propane" five times fast! ). Assuming the same burner efficiency, NG would cost about $1/batch, give or take. But even if it was the same price per BTU, I would use NG for the convenience, alone.

 

Nothing green about induction unless your electricity is being produced by gnomes

 

Fair point, but electric systems tend to be extremely efficient at turning energy into heat, much better than some propane system blowing in the wind.

Anyway, op should be aware of direct heating all in one systems such as high gravity, brau supply, grainfather, etc. They offer a high level of control, efficiency and simplicity.

 

I recently purchased a brau supply 2x1500watt system, it's a clever fix to the 120 volt problem. 2 heating elements, separate circuits, 3000watts of power without any 240v wiring hassle.
I was in a similar position, 1800 watts is simply not enough.

 

@mikehartigan, I'm heating ~8 gallons of water for the mash, 25 gallons for sparge and wash down and then a one hour boil of from 10 to 20 gallons of wort each batch...

 

I did the math with the electricity rate here, and assuming the induction burner was pulling its full capacity for four hours, it came out to less than $1. That's another reason I don't want to use propane.