Help with House Yeast

Discussion in 'Homebrewing' started by hoptualBrew, Jun 27, 2018.

  1. hoptualBrew

    hoptualBrew Defender (644) May 29, 2011 Florida
    Beer Trader

    Looking for:

    English strain
    Top cropper
    Stone fruit ester
    Good clarity in finished beer

    Planning to use this strain for darker beers like Mild, ESB, Oatmeal Stout, Porter, Imperial Stout, etc.

    I really like what WY1968 did recently in my Oatmeal Stout, but it does not top crop.

    Any recommendations are much appreciated.
     
  2. premierpro

    premierpro Aspirant (292) Mar 21, 2009 Michigan

    Not sure about top croping but 1728 will do a good job for you. Good luck!
     
  3. wasatchback

    wasatchback Disciple (319) Jan 12, 2014 Utah
    Beer Trader

    1469 is what you’re looking for... pretty much hits all the requirements

    Peachy
    Tons of krausen
    Clears very well, not as fast as 002
     
  4. hoptualBrew

    hoptualBrew Defender (644) May 29, 2011 Florida
    Beer Trader

    Have used this one a few times, didn’t get much character out of it.

    I fermented 65F & pitched at (estimated) 1M cells/ml/P.

    Perhaps next go round should pitch at lower rate and ferment a few degrees higher.
     
  5. wasatchback

    wasatchback Disciple (319) Jan 12, 2014 Utah
    Beer Trader

    I would suggest much lower, probably half that. Ferment at 68
     
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  6. LuskusDelph

    LuskusDelph Aspirant (291) May 1, 2008 New Jersey

    BRY-97 (and its Wyeast and White Labs equivalent) has long been my new favorite "house" yeast. It's great...and will survive through MANY generations of repitching (my record is currently 27 generations)
     
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  7. wasatchback

    wasatchback Disciple (319) Jan 12, 2014 Utah
    Beer Trader

    I’ve also recently had some good luck with 1272 and the Imperial Version. More interesting than Chico and floccs better.
     
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  8. secondbase

    secondbase Initiate (48) Jun 3, 2015 Tennessee

    I really like 1968, it's a shame you need it to top-crop. I'd recommend 1318 over 1469 because it's a better all-purpose yeast. 1469 may shine a little brighter in certain styles, but I don't care for it in IPA or stouts.
     
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  9. pweis909

    pweis909 Poo-Bah (1,724) Aug 13, 2005 Wisconsin
    Premium Member

    If you don't like 1469, maybe WY1318/Imperial Organic Juice?
    https://www.morebeer.com/products/a38-juice-imperial-organic-yeast.html

    Even though NEIPA seems to be its most common usage among homebrewers lately, I used this in the restricted variant of the Averagely Perfect series, and thought it made a nice porter
     
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  10. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Poo-Bah (3,575) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Premium Member

    I annually ferment a Bitter Ale with 1469 at 70 degrees F. That yeast is pleasantly expressive at that fermentation temperature.

    Cheers!
     
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  11. TooHopTooHandle

    TooHopTooHandle Initiate (176) Dec 20, 2016 New York

    I would recommend 1318 also. Can use it for quite a different styles and it top crops well. That yeast really turns into a fermenting machine when you get around 4 or 5 generations in. I was hitting terminal gravity on 1.065-1.075 beers in just under 48 hours lol. Obviously I let it ride out for 5 or so days after terminal to ensure clean up was performed. I ferment this yeast at 68 degrees.
     
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  12. hoptualBrew

    hoptualBrew Defender (644) May 29, 2011 Florida
    Beer Trader

    @JackHorzempa , was characters did you get from 1469 at 70F?

    I need to try a few split batches with both of these yeasts (1469, 1318) fermented closer to 70F to coax more esters.

    What I’ve got from this thread so far is to try these strains a bit warmer and to pitch a lower count. Will try 0.5M cells/ml/P as well with these warmer ferment temps.
     
  13. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Poo-Bah (3,575) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Premium Member

    An estery (fruity) flavor profile; flavors of stone fruits. Pretty notable flavor level.

    Cheers!
     
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  14. Yalc

    Yalc Initiate (158) Nov 5, 2011 Florida

    This is my favorite for milds and bitters.
     
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  15. VikeMan

    VikeMan Meyvn (1,431) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Beer Trader

    As you said, Wyeast 1968/WLP002 is not really a top cropper. But I know that Fullers does re-use their yeast. They suck it out of the bottom of the conicals IIRC. Any particular reason you want/need to top crop? 1968 does meet your other criteria very well and IMO is excellent across all the English styles (and a lot of American ones too).
     
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  16. Jesse14

    Jesse14 Initiate (172) Jul 21, 2011 Massachusetts

    Might want to consider Nottingham. I've used it for porters, stouts, and IPAs and thought it was well suited for all of them.
     
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  17. GreenKrusty101

    GreenKrusty101 Crusader (752) Dec 4, 2008 Nevada

    WLP-023...much more character than 1968 and less diacetyl
     
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  18. hoptualBrew

    hoptualBrew Defender (644) May 29, 2011 Florida
    Beer Trader

    Looking to start a brewery with a focus on open fermentation. Want to find 1-2 strains to indefinitely top crop for reuse and create some house character.

    I used to work in a brewery that was open fermentation. We used a number of croppable strains but never went beyond a few generations due to brewing so many different styles and lack of motivation by brewery owner to manage yeast extensively.

    But I would really like to have a taproom where guests are able to see open fermentors through glass windows as they drink the beer. Open fermentation is my favorite part of the brewing process. And it makes sense economically to reuse yeast.
     
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  19. pweis909

    pweis909 Poo-Bah (1,724) Aug 13, 2005 Wisconsin
    Premium Member

    Sort of unrelated, but maybe not. The commentary on the 1469 and 1318 strains got me thinking... Are commercial breweries frequently altering fermentation profiles to coax different characteristics out of the same yeast? As a homebrewer, I haven't played around with varying fermentation in a systematic way, focusing more on ingredients and yeast strain varieties. In the dream where I become a commercial brewer, I run a small operation and manage only one yeast strain, and use amazing tricks like varying the temps, pitch rates, and oxygenation to dazzle the crowds at my tasting room with a diverse array of delicious beers, all fermented with one strain. Are there real examples?
     
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  20. riptorn

    riptorn Initiate (138) Apr 26, 2018 North Carolina

    FWIW, you might find these tidbits interesting about the “Ringwood System”.

    Ron Keefe of The Granite Brewery (Toronto, Ontario) in a 10 minute video HERE talks a bit about their open fermentation, which is modeled after what he called The Ringwood System (Ringwood Brewery of the New Forest in Hampshire, England).
    They use Wyeast 1187 Ringwood Ale yeast @ about 64.4° - 71.6° for all their beers except wheat beers. It’s supposedly a very aggressive/active yeast that reaches FG in 2.5 – 3 days. Wyeast says to "Expect distinct fruit esters with a malty, complex profile", but doesn't name which fruits are emulated.
    If brewing on Monday, they scoop yeast on Thursday and put it in the cooler where it goes into suspension.
    If brewing again on Tuesday, they’ll scoop from the actively fermenting beer and pitch it directly to the new batch.

    One week in primary then to the closed secondary cask for conditioning, where temp control is critical for the final beer and for personal safety due to the potential for buildup of excessive pressure.
     
    #20 riptorn, Jun 29, 2018
    Last edited: Jun 29, 2018
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  21. hoptualBrew

    hoptualBrew Defender (644) May 29, 2011 Florida
    Beer Trader

    @pweis909 , I’m sure this is done. Higher pitching rates and lower temps for cleaner fermentation character: lower pitching and higher temps for more ester formation.

    This is what I plan to do at least. Although hard to dial in at home only doing 1-2 batches a month.
     
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  22. SFACRKnight

    SFACRKnight Meyvn (1,176) Jan 20, 2012 Colorado
    Beer Trader

    1318 or GTFO
     
  23. JohnnyChicago

    JohnnyChicago Champion (822) Sep 3, 2010 Illinois

    The way I see it, you’ve got 3 options.

    If you want to do proper British ales with proper open fermentation, use 1469.

    If you want a yeast that can do it all, American, and UK beers, reliably floccs, and can be used for many generations, use 1968,

    If you want something somewhere in the middle, use 1318.

    Remember top cropping and open fermentation are not mutually inclusive. There are breweries that top crop from cylindroconical fermenters and breweries that bottom crop from open fermenters.

    In my experience, true top cropping yeasts are more susceptible to flavor profile shifts and petite mutation sooner. Many brewers who use these (and don’t have a lab) only run them for a couple of generations, if they repitch at all, whereas most bottom croppers can be run for dozens of generations without significant mutation.
     
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  24. TheWorstBrewerEver

    TheWorstBrewerEver Initiate (123) Aug 10, 2016 Norway

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  25. hopfenunmaltz

    hopfenunmaltz Meyvn (1,389) Jun 8, 2005 Michigan

    1469 or WLP 022 Essex would be good choices.
     
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  26. pweis909

    pweis909 Poo-Bah (1,724) Aug 13, 2005 Wisconsin
    Premium Member

    WLP007 provides this kind of style versatility. At one point I used it fairly often. I can't speak to it's re-pitchability, but someone didn't like this aspect of it in a review at whitelabs.
    ("Not without its flaws")
     
  27. JohnnyChicago

    JohnnyChicago Champion (822) Sep 3, 2010 Illinois

    Forgot about that one. It seemed to get chalkier in subsequent generations. I like it and used to use it more. Just like 1968 better.