Homebrew Off-Flavor Question

Discussion in 'Homebrewing' started by rygivens3425, Oct 12, 2015.

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  1. rygivens3425

    rygivens3425 Initiate (0) Sep 30, 2015 Pennsylvania

    I'm a beginner and have brewed and bottled 3 batches so far (a pale ale, an Irish red, and a rye IPA) and I've had the same off-flavor trend with all 3 brews. The beer tastes good (great in the case of the Irish red) on bottling day, and after 2-3 weeks of bottle conditioning at 68-70 degrees, I always throw a bottle in the freezer for an hour and then sample to check the carbonation. Every time I've done this I've been impressed with how good the beer tastes. Then, after I throw the whole batch of bottles in the fridge and wait a few weeks, the beer has a yeasty, bready, taste that masks any malt or hop flavors that I could detect before. I've had the pale ale refrigerated since July 1, and while this taste has subsided some, it is still masking the desired flavor of the beer. Irish Red has been refrigerated since Aug. 20, and the Rye last weekend, and almost all of them taste the same. Has anyone else had this problem, and will time heal this?

    Background: these were all extract, partial boil, 5 gallon batches; star-san was used as sanitizer, I used US-05 or nottingham yeast for these, and they all fermented between 64-70 degrees, all for 4 weeks before bottling.
     
  2. minderbender

    minderbender Initiate (0) Jan 18, 2009 New York

    I don't have much confidence in my diagnosis, but a problem that sets in over time like that sounds like oxidation to me. If the ingredients were bad, or something like that, the beer would never taste good. If I were you, I would try to minimize oxidation when you are bottling your beer, and see if that helps.
     
  3. scottakelly

    scottakelly Maven (1,487) May 9, 2007 Ohio

    I would guess one of three culprits: 1) extract "twang" from only doing a partial boil; 2) oxidation; or 3) not ideal fermentation practices.
     
  4. rygivens3425

    rygivens3425 Initiate (0) Sep 30, 2015 Pennsylvania

    Thanks for the answers! Are there any other sources of oxidation than from too much splashing during bottling?
     
  5. hoptualBrew

    hoptualBrew Initiate (0) May 29, 2011 Florida

    Seems like oxidation. Ideally, if you can get a CO2 tank setup, a Cornelius soda keg, and a beer gun or counter pressure filler, you should be set. You should be purging the bottles with some CO2 prior to filling.

    If budget is tight, I would at least go to bottling bucket with spigot and bottling wand. The former method ($$$) is the best way to fight off oxidation and protect you're beer that you spend hours brewing and weeks fermenting.
     
  6. rygivens3425

    rygivens3425 Initiate (0) Sep 30, 2015 Pennsylvania

    Thanks! I am using a bottling bucket with spigot and bottling wand, that's what I've done for these past 3 anyway... I also should probably mention I am using corn sugar to carbonate.
     
  7. minderbender

    minderbender Initiate (0) Jan 18, 2009 New York

    Yeah, I mean, to put this in perspective, I think a lot of homebrewers are happy with their results without purging their bottles with CO2 etc. It might be helpful, but it is far from necessary. Your beer should not be experiencing problems this severe just because you aren't purging with CO2. (Also, as an aside, there is nothing wrong with using corn sugar as your priming sugar. You could also use table sugar, which is cheaper, but either way, the priming sugar is not the culprit.)

    I don't have any concrete suggestions. You could try brewing a porter - dark beers are less susceptible to oxidation. If the porter holds up better, that's a sign that the problem was oxygen.
     
    ChrisMyhre likes this.
  8. drinkybanjo

    drinkybanjo Crusader (457) Sep 4, 2008 New Jersey

    Maybe bring a bottle or two to your local Home Brew shop for the staff to taste and opine?
     
    jnrjr79 likes this.
  9. rygivens3425

    rygivens3425 Initiate (0) Sep 30, 2015 Pennsylvania

    Thanks, everyone! I think I will have to take a bottle to the homebrew store, or find an experienced brewer to try these. Before I considered oxidation as a problem, I thought there might just be too much yeast in suspension, because over time the taste is getting a little better. Could this be a possibility? Or does yeast typically fall out of suspension within a few weeks of refrigeration?
     
  10. ssam

    ssam Pundit (997) Dec 2, 2008 California

    Yes. Actually this is what I initially suspected. If you are tasting a "yeasty" flavor, it might be yeast. Maybe if you pour carefully enough to keep the yeast sediment out of your glass you'll get rid of that off flavor.

    "Yeasty" or "bready" aren't typical descriptors of off flavors from oxidation.

    From How to Brew:
    Yeasty
    The cause of this flavor is pretty easy to understand. If the yeast is unhealthy and begins autolyzing it will release compounds that can only be described as yeasty. Also if the beer is green, too young, and the yeast has not had time to settle out, it will have a yeasty taste. Watch your pouring method too, keep the yeast layer on the bottom of the bottle.
     
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  11. minderbender

    minderbender Initiate (0) Jan 18, 2009 New York

    Yeah, I mean, the question is what to do with this evidence:

    One thing we could do is write this off as an artifact of a small sample size or some kind of psychological phenomenon. But if we take it seriously, then we need a flaw that isn't apparent at first, but that becomes overwhelming within a few weeks, during which the beer is refrigerated. It could be that there is not much yeast in suspension when the beer has been in the freezer for an hour, but there is a lot more yeast in the beer after a few weeks of refrigeration. Since that seems unlikely to me, my initial thought was oxidation, which would dull the beer's hop flavors and leave behind everything else. But maybe something about the freezer time takes yeast out of suspension especially thoroughly.
     
  12. hopfenunmaltz

    hopfenunmaltz Pooh-Bah (2,635) Jun 8, 2005 Michigan
    Pooh-Bah

    Have someone who is a trained taster give you an evaluation. A local brewery would be a good start, have the Brewer taste it. Find a local Homebrew club, go to a meeting, ask who is the best at evaluating beer, ask for constructive honest feedback.
     
  13. Wanda

    Wanda Zealot (518) Nov 23, 2006 Tennessee

    Yes it does fall out at lower temps. In fact many if not most homebrewers practice something called "cold crashing" which involves chilling the finished beer down into the 30's for a few days to a week in order to get the yeast out of suspension thus resulting in a clearer final product. Don't worry, there will still be enough suspended to carbonate, it may take an extra few days though, but you'll see a difference in the clarity.

    I might still take it to a homebrew store of find an experienced homebrewer to sample but I think @ssam hit it on the nose. If you haven't read "How to Brew" yet I'd get a copy stat. You won't regret it.
     
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