How can I improve my mash efficiency?

Discussion in 'Homebrewing' started by chrisjws, Jan 11, 2016.

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  1. telejunkie

    telejunkie Savant (1,107) Sep 14, 2007 Vermont

    my first thought is to try batch sparging a couple times. If the needle doesn't move much, then I'd focus on the crush or water. Fly sparging is not always the best. I had troubles with channeling when fly sparging with a system very similar to what you have. I always batch sparge now if I use that mash tun. I fly sparge with my other mash tuns.
     
  2. chrisjws

    chrisjws Grand Pooh-Bah (3,302) Dec 3, 2014 California
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    So I'm working on researching water and getting to where I'll feel comfortable treating it myself. Seems like most of the kits out there that can do measurements are in the $100-200 range. Is that what most here use, or what types of tools do you use to analyze your water on day of brewing?

    I'm planning on building my own grain mill in the coming months and seeing if I can get my crush dialed in. Are there any pointers for how I should judge a crush? Crushed grain looks like crushed grain to my eyes, so I'm not fully certain what the ideal crush would look like.

    In the meantime my next batch or two are probably going to be extract while I get these things figured out. Probably going to be IPAs which I've found to be quite good made from extract.
     
  3. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,375) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Society Pooh-Bah

    I do not analyze my tap water on the day of brewing. I have a water report from my municipal water company and I use the information of that report in my preferred water tool: MpH calculator.

    For folks who have wells you can send a sample of your well water to Ward Laboratories for testing and obtain a water report: https://producers.wardlab.com/BrewersKitOrder.php

    Cheers!
     
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  4. SaCkErZ9

    SaCkErZ9 Grand Pooh-Bah (3,057) Feb 27, 2005 South Carolina
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Mash efficiency was a big help for me. I went from about 75% to 82-85%. I use 5.2 Mash Stabilizer from my HB store and that helped overnight.
    I also use sparge water closer to 175F-180F.
    http://www.midwestsupplies.com/5-2-mash-stabilizer.html
     
  5. MmmmmmBeer123

    MmmmmmBeer123 Initiate (0) Nov 15, 2015 Connecticut

    I'd also vote to look at your grain crush. My 1st-ever all grain batch had a mash efficiency of ~50%. I posted a thread in the middle of the process...pH, temperature were spot-on. My 2nd batch, I did slightly change a few process things, but not dramatically so as compared to the 1st. I did notice that there seemed to be quite a bit of grains that were holding a lot of starch...so for my 2nd batch, I ran the grains thru the mill at the LHBS twice. My efficiency 2nd batch was 72.5%.
     
  6. Hanglow

    Hanglow Pooh-Bah (2,051) Feb 18, 2012 Scotland
    Pooh-Bah

    You just need something like this to test for alkalinity
    http://www.amazon.com/Salifert-Carbonate-Hardness-Alkalinity-100-200/dp/B001EJ3DOG .

    You can then get your ph in the right area on brew day. You do not need expensive equipment for that. That kit should be good for 100 brews, testing before and after you treat/ dilute and treat your water


    Some supplies vary depending on demand, rainwater etc etc. Mine is very stable and very low in any form of minerals so I never bother testing it or need to buy in/filter water, but I do have to add calcium etc depending on beer


    If you are continuing to use RO water then I don't think you'll even need to get a testing kit, just build it up based on the calculators linked^^^
     
  7. chrisjws

    chrisjws Grand Pooh-Bah (3,302) Dec 3, 2014 California
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    My understanding based on reading so far is that not all RO water will have the same profile, is that incorrect? I'm planning on asking the store I get water from if they have a report on the water profile next time I go there, as I assume they'd probably have that information.
     
  8. Brew_Betty

    Brew_Betty Initiate (0) Jan 5, 2015 Wisconsin

    Not all RO water is the same. Don't assume store bought RO water is mineral and salt free. It can vary quite bit depending on the source. It can vary at the same source. You can buy a cheap TDS meter to check the water.
     
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  9. Hanglow

    Hanglow Pooh-Bah (2,051) Feb 18, 2012 Scotland
    Pooh-Bah

    There you go. I was thinking of distilled :flushed:
     
  10. chavinparty

    chavinparty Zealot (653) Jan 4, 2015 New Hampshire

    I had efficiency problems with my 10 gallon cooler fly sparging so I bought a 72 qt rectangular cooler and now my efficiency is .02 higher on average. I am now batch sparging but I had tried batch sparging with my old cooler to no gain. My point is with poor efficiency in a Home Depot cooler on 100+ batches I think the plastic had something to do with it. I've brewed with people with the same setup and milled identical grain bills and water to have mine 1 or 2 a very lower in the end.... A great mystery. But I'm pumped with my rectangular cooler.
     
  11. chrisjws

    chrisjws Grand Pooh-Bah (3,302) Dec 3, 2014 California
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    I'll look into getting a TDS meter. PH can vary as well, no? My understanding is pretty much any of the 5 we pay attention to can vary in RO water.
     
  12. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    FWIW, pH of your source water isn't relevant to your mash pH. Alkalinity and calcium and magnesium ion concentrations are.
     
  13. YamBag

    YamBag Initiate (0) Feb 2, 2007 Pennsylvania

    How about distilled water, is it always the same and 100% stripped of salts/minerals?
     
  14. atomeyes

    atomeyes Initiate (0) Jul 13, 2011 Canada (ON)

    no one's mentioned sparge rate.
    but go low and slow on your sparge regardless of the method you use. obvs fly sparge, that's more important. but i'd even look at a batch sparge taking around 45 min
     
  15. Brew_Betty

    Brew_Betty Initiate (0) Jan 5, 2015 Wisconsin

    It should be more reliable than RO water. One way to find out is to buy a cheap TDS meter. They cost $10-$15.
     
  16. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    When I batch sparge, I pretty much let 'er rip. I don't know of any reason to go slow with batch sparging.
     
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  17. atomeyes

    atomeyes Initiate (0) Jul 13, 2011 Canada (ON)

    no science behind it.
    i'm just thinking of how to best pull/extract sugars from grain.
    if you batch sparge in 2-3 batches? you can likely let 'er rip.
    1 batch? i'd go slower.
     
  18. DAllspaw

    DAllspaw Initiate (0) Nov 7, 2009 Indiana

    At the risk of being redundant, my efficiency and hitting my OG target improved quite a bit when I switched to RO, and added minerals (per BrewCypher water treatment tab) to settle in the range of 5.4. My beer tastes better too. Adding some minerals takes only a couple more mins to measure out than a spoonful of 5.2 stabilizer. Like everything else, it just becomes part of the routine.
     
  19. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    I single batch sparge. I believe the gravity of the wort from the sparge runnings that makes it to the kettle is exactly the same as the wort absorbed by the grains and in the deadspace after the sparge. Assuming the same volume of wort is drained by slow vs fast sparge, efficiency has to be the same. I am also assuming full conversion during the mash.
     
  20. atomeyes

    atomeyes Initiate (0) Jul 13, 2011 Canada (ON)

    then wouldn't that logic hold true for a fly sparge as well?
    never seen a brewery gun it with a fly sparge (might be to avoid grist entering the kettle)
     
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