IPA: England vs. New World

Discussion in 'Beer Talk' started by CochonKing, Dec 9, 2013.

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  1. CochonKing

    CochonKing Initiate (0) Dec 7, 2013 New York

    Just wondering how other people judge IPAs. I tend to judge countries separate from each other such as England and the U.S being distinct types. Does anyone feel IPAs should be judged from the original standards in England? English levels of bitter are much lower and alpha acid content is not nearly as high, so many American IPAs would be receive remarkable low scores immediately if judged this way. American IPAs IBU can range from medium to near off the chart. Just wondering what other people think in terms of judgement.
     
  2. DinoFight

    DinoFight Initiate (0) Jan 23, 2013 Arizona

    I tend to view English and American IPA's as two different animals. But, if you think too much about it you can drive yourself nuts. IPA's in General can be so different from one another even in the US. West coast vs East coast as an example.
     
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  3. surfrogue1

    surfrogue1 Zealot (605) Mar 14, 2013 Maryland

    American Brewers tend to go sky high with the hops...different hops, different hopping techniques...so AIPAs tend to be sweeter maybe?...the higher the IBUs , the more ABV, the more sugar. And I love my sugar! So, I am partial to the AIPAs.
     
  4. CochonKing

    CochonKing Initiate (0) Dec 7, 2013 New York

    But is it residual sugar or just perceptual sugar? I haven't noticed a lot of residual sugar on the palate with American IPA's as compared to English. I have noticed perceived sweetness from American fruit forward brewing techniques. Just like with our wines we tend to push fruit forward at all times while old world styles are meant to be drank with food instead of by themselves.
     
  5. herrburgess

    herrburgess Grand Pooh-Bah (3,077) Nov 4, 2009 South Carolina
    Pooh-Bah

    This is a good comparison. Put another way:

    U.S. IPAs are more about thrill-seeking and UK IPAs are more about daily drinking.
     
  6. TheBungyo

    TheBungyo Pooh-Bah (2,037) Dec 1, 2004 Washington
    Pooh-Bah

    The fact that they're listed as two separate styles on this very site should more than answer your question.
     
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  7. CochonKing

    CochonKing Initiate (0) Dec 7, 2013 New York

    This site isn't the inconclusive rule when it comes to beer, so no it does not. I could make the argument that English IPAs were the initial standard, so all IPA style beers should meet that standard. See what I'm saying. There is a lot of grey area.
     
  8. DarkDragon999

    DarkDragon999 Maven (1,331) Feb 13, 2013 Rhode Island

    English have breweries that dont brew IPA's and that would be unthinkable in America.
     
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  9. marquis

    marquis Pooh-Bah (2,313) Nov 20, 2005 England
    Pooh-Bah

    But which IPAs ?They changed significantly as you would expect over the century and a bit that they were shipped out.And there were the domestic versions too.
    The characteristics were ; low ABV by the standards of the day, often the weakest beers from a brewery,highly attenuated ie dry as dust,highly hopped, matured and as a consequence usually Brett infected.It's true to say that nobody these days brews anything like this , perhaps Orval is closest.
    Throw in the fact that styles were a long way into the future and beers were simply given names.Some brewers never used the term IPA for their versions.By about 1920 IPA was just another word for bitter or Pale Ale.This is something the style ****s can't get their heads around and they insist that beers like Greene King IPA are wrongly labelled.But they are no more removed from the originals than present day West Coast versions.
    Worthington White Shield (now owned by Coors) has been brewed since 1829 but like my Dad's broom which has had three new heads and two handles it isn't the original article :slight_smile:
    By the way, don't forget that Edinburgh was the world's #2 brewer of IPA.Forget the myth that Scots used few hops, they brewed by the quaysides and used literally ship loads of hops.Often they used Saaz or other continental hops as well as English ones and also from the US.So "English" IPA is a misnomer.
    Heerburgess is right too.British beer drinkers on the whole have different drinking habits, good beer is centred round the pub and bottles form a tiny proportion of craft beer sales.They want beer you can drink by the pint, several in a session,so drinkability is important.
    So which is the "true" IPA ? None of them and all of them.Don't worry, you will be able to find one to suit you and that's all that matters.
     
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  10. Zimbo

    Zimbo Pooh-Bah (2,305) Aug 7, 2010 Scotland
    Pooh-Bah

    Hopping levels and varieties are major differences. As is the method of dispense.
     
  11. Flibber

    Flibber Initiate (0) Jul 27, 2013 England

    What's English IPA? Greene King IPA? Worthington's White Shield? Magic Rock Cannonball? Fuller's Bengal Lancer?

    I'm not sure it's possible to pin down English IPA as a style in the same way as you can with American IPA.
     
  12. AlcahueteJ

    AlcahueteJ Grand Pooh-Bah (3,242) Dec 4, 2004 Massachusetts
    Society Pooh-Bah

    They're owned by Coors? I had no idea. I enjoyed their Red Shield.
     
  13. AlcahueteJ

    AlcahueteJ Grand Pooh-Bah (3,242) Dec 4, 2004 Massachusetts
    Society Pooh-Bah

    Well put. I enjoy American IPAs, but I prefer UK IPAs. I can actually taste the malt.
     
  14. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,375) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Society Pooh-Bah

    A number of US brewed IPAs have a noticeable malt backbone: Victory HopDevil, Sierra Nevada Celebration, Southampton Burton IPA, Dogfish Head 60 minute IPA, Deschutes Inversion, ….

    Cheers!
     
  15. marquis

    marquis Pooh-Bah (2,313) Nov 20, 2005 England
    Pooh-Bah

    They are owned but not run by Coors. Coors financed improvements and modernisation of the brewery , engaged a very good brewer and lets him get on with it.
     
  16. hopfenunmaltz

    hopfenunmaltz Pooh-Bah (2,635) Jun 8, 2005 Michigan
    Pooh-Bah

    Trumer pils?
     
  17. patto1ro

    patto1ro Pooh-Bah (2,084) Apr 26, 2004 Netherlands
    Pooh-Bah

    There were no original standards. 19th-century British IPAs were totally unlike modern British IPAs and modern American IPAs.

    British IPAs also varied over time and geography. In London and parts of the Southeast, IPA was often weaker than Pale Ale.

    And the hopping levels of British IPAs and Pale Ales was often totally crzay in the past. When I pump 19th century recipes through BeerSmith - even knocking down the quanitity for deterioration in storage and assumiing just 4% alpha acid - they average over 150 IBUs. Typical would be about 7 pounds of hops per 36-gallon Imperial barrel. The equivalent of about a pound of hops for 6 US gallons.
     
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  18. MostlyNorwegian

    MostlyNorwegian Pooh-Bah (2,236) Feb 5, 2013 Illinois
    Pooh-Bah

    No, and I am against the judgement of them by some sort of universal bar as well. It's just not wise because there are far too many variables and most importantly among them is that there are regional tastes and preferences, and history is not going to be friendly to this either because of the same thing.
     
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