Lager Brewers: Did I botch this starter?

Discussion in 'Homebrewing' started by Finn, Apr 6, 2012.

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  1. Finn

    Finn Initiate (0) Nov 20, 2003 Pennsylvania

    Hey folks, I am brand new to lager brewing, and I made a starter sort of by the seat of my pants. I am wondering if you think it's a usable starter or if I should try again with different technique:

    -I pitched a smack pack of Wyeast Budvar into about 1.25 L of low gravity wort (about 1.025) at room temp (about 67 F)
    -Two days later, after fermentation had got up and going, and seemed to calm, I added another 1.25 L. or so of wort (about 1.025). A day or so later I threw it in the fridge, and it has been there since. (about 4 days)

    So, I am quite aware I didn't make this starter in an ideal fashion, but am wondering if anyone sees any inherent big problems with it, or if I can go ahead and use it in a modest-gravity lager (1.045) in the next week.

    Any input much appreciated!
     
    #1 Finn, Apr 6, 2012
  2. michaeltrego

    michaeltrego Crusader (447) May 21, 2004 New Hampshire

    Botch? No. Usable? Yes. Assuming you had a fresh pack and did simple intermittent shaking of the starter, a quick calculation shows that you should target about 333B cells and your method should result in about 312B cells. So...I think you are close enough and good to go! Here's a good calculator for future reference: http://www.yeastcalc.com/
     
    #2 michaeltrego, Apr 6, 2012
  3. cracker

    cracker Pundit (893) May 2, 2004 Pennsylvania

    Should be ok. Not sure if it's enough yeast according to online calculators such as mr malty. But it should definitely ferment your batch. Why did you make a starter with an OG of 1.025? Most people aim for 1.040 in a starter.
     
    #3 cracker, Apr 6, 2012
  4. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    Yeah, I'm a little worried about the 1.025 gravity, which would have limited the growth.
    To OP: also, by not decanting between steps, you essentially pitched into wort with a gravity of 1.013 on the second step.

    Personally, I would crash and decant this, then pitch into a starter wort of proper size and gravity, using Mr. Malty or similar calculation. I would eyeball the amount of yeast I have right now to decide if it is significatly more than what came out of the smackpack. (At low gravities, they may have been making beer rather than significantly more cells.)
     
    #4 VikeMan, Apr 6, 2012
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  5. Finn

    Finn Initiate (0) Nov 20, 2003 Pennsylvania

    Cool thanks for the info everyone! I've only ever done simple one-step starters for ales, so I am trying to pick up info on multi-step starters for lagers.
     
    #5 Finn, Apr 6, 2012
  6. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    The imporatant difference between ale and lager starters is the cell count needed, which (all other tings being equal) makes it more likely to need to step-up with lagers. Here's an excellent calculator to use for step-up starters. And there is good info on the same site to help understand what's going on...

    http://www.yeastcalc.com/
     
    #6 VikeMan, Apr 6, 2012
  7. MLucky

    MLucky Initiate (0) Jul 31, 2010 California

    This. Lagers take a long, long, long-ass time to make, and you don't want to get to the end of that months-long process and find out you have off-flavors because you pitched low. Stepping the starter up one more time would almost certainly give you a more than adequate cell count. Better safe than sorry.
     
    #7 MLucky, Apr 6, 2012
  8. cracker

    cracker Pundit (893) May 2, 2004 Pennsylvania

    A wee bit of exaggeration there wouldn't you say? Other than lagering (range 4 weeks to several months), I don't keep them in primary any longer than my ales (~3 weeks). In fact as I always have a nice inventory of full kegs (at least 3 at a given time), they don't take me any 'longer' than my ales.
     
    #8 cracker, Apr 6, 2012
  9. MLucky

    MLucky Initiate (0) Jul 31, 2010 California

    Well, OK, "other than lagering" (ie, the step that takes the most time!) I suppose lagers don't take much more time than ales. But I tend to think of lagering as part of the process involved in making lagers.
     
    #9 MLucky, Apr 6, 2012
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