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Discussion in 'Great Lakes' started by Lansman, May 29, 2012.

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  1. 1up

    1up Mar 5, 2013 District of Columbia

    I've found that in my experience canning works really well for some styles and not at all for others. It works especially well for hoppy brews. There is a brewpub in Baltimore called Brewer's Art. They bottle and can two of their beers: Resurrection and Ozzy. I love these beers. The bottled format is 750ml and the canning format is standard 12oz cans. These are Belgian style ales and do not taste nearly as good out of a can (though the price is much more reasonable). I personally like 12oz bottles best for non hoppy beers. Price per ounce on bombers and 750s makes it prohibitive to buy them often. $10 for 22oz (45 cents per oz) vs. $10 for a four pack (21 cents per oz). Not even close. There is some psychological phenomenon (involving wine?) that is playing out on this one. I'd think buying in quantity with less materials would be cheaper but that's almost never the case.

    Glad you guys are getting a new system. Cheers to the notion of smaller format!
     
  2. BeerMeFitz

    BeerMeFitz Oct 24, 2011 Illinois

    It is a state law. It has a long story attached to it that ended badly.... Gov Ryan! Alot of stores don't know the law or care as long as you got cash. Get a passport! Problem solved!
     
    Vav likes this.
  3. Pipeworks

    Pipeworks May 28, 2009 Illinois

    nice reaction time Fitz... they teach that at the academy?
     
    BeerMeFitz, Cotchept and Vav like this.
  4. Pipeworks

    Pipeworks May 28, 2009 Illinois

    interesting when you put it in those terms... it actually does cost us exactly twice per ounce to make the beer we put in bombers (on average, higher gravity) then it does for the beer that might possibly end up in aluminum...

    the other big cost factor is that those 750ml Belgian bottles cost us $1.00 a piece... and the 22oz bottles ~$0.50, so that's the biggest price driver in large format bottles.
     
  5. justyouraveragebeerguy

    justyouraveragebeerguy Feb 5, 2013 Illinois

    How about 12oz bottles and 4packs?
     
  6. 1up

    1up Mar 5, 2013 District of Columbia

    Yeah I'm okay with paying for a beer by gravity. That makes sense to me. Like KBS for example is (at the brewery's taproom price) $19 for a four pack. That is in line with a $10 bomber for price per oz. I'm perfectly fine with that, it's definitely worth that price. I guess my real point was that bombers/750ml beers vs. 12oz beers of the equivalent gravity usually end up having different price points.

    Take BCBS in 22oz format vs. BCBS in 12oz format. This is a great example because not only are we comparing beers of almost exactly the same gravity and from the same brewery, but also literally almost exactly the same liquid as well (except for the addition of coffee so yes that's an additional expense). I'm not sure what the suggested retail price was, but I'm just going to use the cheapest price I saw them retail for.
    BCBCS bomber --> 22oz, $21 = $.95 per oz.
    BCBS four pack --> 48oz, $24 = $.50 per oz.

    Here's another example that I noticed. Stone sells a lot of their IPAs in four or six packs and in bombers. Now these are not only exactly the same gravity, but literally the same liquid in the bottles which makes for an even better example.
    Stone IPA bomber --> 22oz, $7 = $.31
    Stone IPA sixer --> 64oz, $12 = $.18

    And I have seen this phenomenon many times. I think consumers are 'fooled' by the bottle size because we think of big format bottles as fancy due to the subconscious feeling our culture has pushed us into toward wine. Wine comes in a big bottle so a big bottle must mean fancy. Beer historically has come in 12oz bottles and until recently was considered very blue collar, inexpensive, and less fancy. So when buying a larger format bottle the consumer feels more justified with paying $10+ with a large format bottle.

    All that being said, I have zero problem with $10 a bomber for a high gravity beer. But paying that same price/oz ratio for a lower gravity beer just becomes too expensive over time and will push me to buy other brands with better price points. Of course I am always willing to have a good beer every now and again (almost) regardless of the price point.

    ...just a few thoughts. Hope it's useful for someone.
     
  7. mjohnson17

    mjohnson17 Apr 29, 2012 Illinois
    Beer Trader

    I was thinking the same thing, thanks for clarifying. The term "brewhouse" can be easily confused. But you're talking about the components that make up your brewing setup (mash/lauter tun, controls, heat exchanger, cooling, kettle, etc).

    I do think canning is a great option that you should consider. It appears more cost effective for both you and the consumer (minus upfront cost of canning equipment) plus I think the market is really coming around to the can format. Beer in cans isn't frowned upon as macro or swill anymore. Locally I think Revolution is doing a good job with offering just a few of their beers in can format. I would agree with 1up in that hoppy beers tend to hold up best from a can but again Revolution's porter and wit hold up well. In addition I think Vivant is doing nice things with canned belgians.

    Long story short; if you put beer in a can I would buy the shit out of it.
     
  8. Lansman

    Lansman Mar 19, 2011 Missouri
    Beer Trader

    April 19, 2013 Update
    <Apologies for the lateness of the update>

    Hello Friends,

    It's weeks like these where we take a moment to pause and appreciate that we are living the dream and our thankful to do so. We get to wake up every morning (albeit way too early) and brew beer every day and call that a job. So we are thankful to all of you for making that a reality.

    This week brings us:

    Cascade Ninja - just like Citra Ninja but made with Cascade hops from Hop Head Farms in Michigan: http://www.hopheadfarms.com/ should be $10.99/22oz bottle

    Murderous English-style Barleywine - this is a variation on Santa vs Unicorn, but English yeast, much less hops, bit sweeter with more caramel, and just a hint of Nelson Sauvin, should be $9.99/22oz bottle and delicious now, but also good with a bit of cellaring.

    Both of these are extremely limited and we have sent 10 cases of each to Binny's Lincoln Park and West Lakeview Liquors available now for pickup.

    We met with our new Alderman this week, Scott Waguespak of the 32nd ward, and we are very happy to have Scott as an Alderman. Scott is supportive of our bottle shop project and we should be introducing an ordinance during the June City Council meeting to move that forward. The bottle shop will be located very near our 1675 location but not in it as initially planned. The bottle shop location will have parking and is also connected to a much larger space that we may be using for a very exciting 2014 project... Our new brewhouse should be coming next week and we'll be installing it the first week of May.

    On deck:

    Simcoe Ninja
    Raspberry Truffle Abduction
    Citrus IPA brewed with Tired Hands Brewing
    CA$H 4 Golden Ale
    Summery Saisons (TBD)
    Poivre Rose
    Revenge of the Unicorn
    A Foolish Wit
    Majestic English Summer Ale
    End of Days

    We'll announce our Chicago Craft Beer Week schedule next week.

    -PW
     
    hombrepalo likes this.
  9. kawilliams81

    kawilliams81 Feb 27, 2009 Illinois
    Beer Trader

    I have heard for awhile that PW would like to eventually can some beers, but nothing concrete to when or if that will actually happen. But, I would put more money on them eventually canning than not.
     
  10. crossovert

    crossovert Mar 29, 2009 Illinois

    yeah im gonna use my passport in il form now on.
     
  11. Pipeworks

    Pipeworks May 28, 2009 Illinois

    [​IMG]
     
    Etan, JulianC, VagabondHops and 7 others like this.
  12. maximthegreat

    maximthegreat Feb 13, 2013 Illinois
    Beer Trader


    Put your beer in an smaller format, whether cans or 12oz bottles, and Pipeworks would be 90% of what I drink.
     
    1up and Nachos4two like this.
  13. Nachos4two

    Nachos4two Nov 26, 2011 Illinois
    Beer Trader

    That's quite a tease if I do say so myself!
     
  14. Davihaw

    Davihaw Jun 19, 2012 Illinois
    Beer Trader

    Did anyone get Cascade Ninja in the Western Suburbs? My two local shops in Lombard and Glen Ellyn never received their shipments. Did I miss it or did it just go to the city only?
     
  15. pmoney

    pmoney Apr 15, 2011 Illinois
    Beer Trader

    They only made it to the city.
     
  16. Davihaw

    Davihaw Jun 19, 2012 Illinois
    Beer Trader

    Bummer:( Thanks for responding!
     
  17. ppohio

    ppohio Aug 5, 2011 Illinois
    Beer Trader

    Hello! That one might go even faster than Raspberry Truffle Abduction!
     
  18. spicoli00

    spicoli00 Jul 6, 2005 Indiana

    think this was from a FB post, not sure if there is any still left...

    there are 30 other cases out there somewhere in the city (only suburban drops for Cascade are: Binny's Skokie, Binny's Highland Park, Cardinal Niles & Norridge)
     
  19. Pipeworks

    Pipeworks May 28, 2009 Illinois

    would you could you in a can?

    [​IMG]
     
    Etan, LSMroz, jbecke2 and 23 others like this.
  20. JimGlonke

    JimGlonke Apr 27, 2012 Illinois
    Beer Trader

    Easily. Just give me the chance!
     
    crushedvol likes this.
  21. Nachos4two

    Nachos4two Nov 26, 2011 Illinois
    Beer Trader

    Your killing me smalls!
     
    Theredflame2 likes this.
  22. RomanMaronie

    RomanMaronie Apr 8, 2013 Illinois

    [​IMG]
     
    LSMroz, jbecke2, Mjmoser and 5 others like this.
  23. ravot

    ravot Mar 20, 2012 Illinois
    Beer Trader

    well that escalated quickly ^^^^
     
    LSMroz, sliverX, stevegoz and 2 others like this.
  24. RWNay

    RWNay Oct 7, 2010 Illinois
    Subscriber

    OUTSTANDING ! ! !

    Now, hopefully Pipeworks will start making more beer so you can sell it to those of us in Kane County. Fingers crossed!!! Beer hunting is fun, but I would buy much more of your beer if it was available in my area. Thanks for all that you do, keep up the good work!!!
     
    1up, PHBoiler and Nachos4two like this.
  25. dahorn_spartan

    dahorn_spartan Sep 13, 2012 North Carolina

    BonerJamz 2013!
     
    Deltoro likes this.
  26. mtskier

    mtskier Feb 23, 2013 Illinois
    Beer Trader

    Great post that really sums up my frustrations. I will still buy bombers, because unfortunately its often the only way to try new beers, but it limits my purchases. I have a really hard time justifying spending that much more /oz all the time.
     
    RWNay likes this.
  27. spicoli00

    spicoli00 Jul 6, 2005 Indiana

    Hey yo! Just passed the falcon being loaded up with RTA and what appeared to be simcoe ninja
     
  28. xtrastoutalex

    xtrastoutalex Jul 3, 2012 Illinois

    EOD is everywhere round chicago. Very good. A bit under-rated.
     
    PDZ likes this.
  29. Mjmoser

    Mjmoser May 6, 2012 Illinois

    Tell me more about Citrus IPA!!!!
     
    ravot likes this.
  30. kawilliams81

    kawilliams81 Feb 27, 2009 Illinois
    Beer Trader

    Drink it, drank it, drunk I am.
     
  31. Treebs

    Treebs Apr 18, 2011 Illinois

    People leave it on the shelves because of the reviews, all which are skewed by the first batch which wasn't that good. I'm glad it sits on the shelves as much as it does because I can go pick it up whenever I want.
     
  32. RC0032

    RC0032 Mar 10, 2009 Illinois
    Beer Trader

    My complete disappointment with West Lakeview continues. They don't hold SHIT for the FwB people...

    Binnys is a PITA to get to for me but looks like I need to change pickup locals. How does one do this?
     
  33. spicoli00

    spicoli00 Jul 6, 2005 Indiana

    Binny's is generally okay, but i get the feeling it's the same drill as WLV. i usually try to do my pickup within a day or two of the email drop to ensure i get my bottle(s).
     
  34. kodt

    kodt Mar 6, 2013 Illinois

    RTA and Simcoe hitting stores this week?
     
  35. bgrzywa2

    bgrzywa2 Nov 8, 2011 Illinois

    What is this FwB group? I've seen Vav tweet that some beers will only be available for them until a certain time.
     
  36. pmoney

    pmoney Apr 15, 2011 Illinois
    Beer Trader

    FwB means Friends with Benefits. It's people who contributed to their kickstarter campaign.
     
  37. bgrzywa2

    bgrzywa2 Nov 8, 2011 Illinois

    Ah got it. Knew what it stood for but wasn't sure what it meant...on a beer forum
     
  38. xtrastoutalex

    xtrastoutalex Jul 3, 2012 Illinois

    Exactly. The flavor imparted by the chilies is quite complex.
     
  39. Pipeworks

    Pipeworks May 28, 2009 Illinois

    they are. I think we are waiting for Simcoe Ninja to be put in Binny's computer system. So should be tomorrow available for pick-up unless Vav knows if it's in earlier.
     
    rmalinowski4 and Nachos4two like this.
  40. kawilliams81

    kawilliams81 Feb 27, 2009 Illinois
    Beer Trader

    And, of course I drove to Binny's to pick up my Cascade Ninja today and could have picked up both tomorrow. #FWBproblems
     
    danimalarkey likes this.
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