Mash-out, Denaturing and Sparging

I use a cooler mash tun, mash for 60 minutes, don't mash out and sparge with 170-180F water. The pH of the sparge water is 5.4.

My OG and FG are typically what Beersmith predicts +/- 2 points.

 

Single batch sparge.

 

No, I don't try to get to 168F and don't hold the sparge long enough to mash out anyway. 170-180F sparge water gets the grain bed into the low 160s with 15lbs of grain.

 

Pretty much exactly what I do, and I've had no issues hitting expected gravity.

I usually don't check the grain bed temp during the sparge, but when I have in the past it was around 165 (I usually shoot for sparge water temp of 175)

 

You definitely don't want to sparge with water near boiling temp or else you will extract a lot of tannin and other nasties from the grain husk and it will heavily affect the flavor of the brew.

A mash out is not required. Brewers typically do them because they are trying to get the most out of the enzymes activity, making them work faster and push them to the temperature limit as they work best just before being destroyed.

Mashing out just gives you a little better conversion, that's all. But I prefer not to mash out most of the time as I prefer the flavors I get when just conducting my mash inside the "brewer's window" utilizing the specific temperature/time for the specific beer I'm brewing and the fermentability I'm going for.

I typically do a single temperature infusion mash and single batch sparge with water at 169 Fahrenheit. This works for MOST beer styles, I change it up when brewing styles that need it.

I've had brews from homebrewers who used water above 170 degrees for sparging and they always have an "acrid" like astringent tannic off flavor. Not pleasant to my palette.

Denaturing the enzyme isn't a specific goal of your mashing process, it's just part of the process- pushing the enzymes to work for you. In fact most enzymes other than Alpha Amylase are denatured well before they do anything significant (In a single temperature infusion mash anyways).

Making the starch in barley soluble requires a temp of at least 140 degrees- this will denature/destroy most enzymes; alpha amylase being the exception.

I actually think/perceive a mash-out as an outlier of negative wort flavors.Hence no mash out and just verlouf and sparge.

 

However, tannin extraction is highly pH dependent. If your wort pH was adjusted to optimize the mash, I believe it also will be low enough that tannin extraction is not a major risk. The practice of decoction exemplifies that you can boil grains and not extract copious amounts of tannins. It's the pH, or maybe witchcraft.

 

When batch sparging, I do exactly as brewbetty does (although usually double batch sparge) and just sparge with water at like 180-190F. This will usually bring the grains up toward mash out. If I'm fly sparging, I'll usually at least get the mash up to 160-165F before starting the fly sparge to denature the B-amylase. But honestly, I care more about getting the grain bed warm for viscosity reasons since as soon as there is about 2L of wort in my kettle, I'm firing it up so the wort is basically right below boiling during the whole sparge process and ready for boil & 1st hop addition within a few minutes after I'm finished up with the sparge. It's all about time-savers in my book.

 

My responses to the original three questions:

1) Denaturing the enzymes is not usually important at all in a homebrew setting, unless you plan on doing something odd like leaving the wort sitting around for hours and hours or overnight before you boil it.

2) I use ~190 F water for sparging, for the reasons you cite. 170 F water isn't going to get you there. In reality, it doesn't really matter anyway. Scientifically there is no appreciable improvement in viscosity or solubility between 150s F and 170 F. Plus you don't even need a mashout for the reasons given above. So why bother even with the 190 F or boiling water. It really just doesn't matter!!! All that might matter is rinsing with any water at all, IF you care about efficiency...... and that's a whole 'nother discussion I won't get into right now.

3) 100% success with skipping mashouts or 170 F. Anyone who claims different is probably just fooling themselves and you.

Cheers.

P.S. Furthermore, extraction of tannins is only a consideration for fly spargers, where the pH grows higher and higher over the course of the sparge, eventually hitting the undesirable 5.6-5.8 range or more. As you can see, this has nothing to do with temperature but everything to do with pH. The old 70 F temperature thing is bogus. Don't believe it? Taste a decocted beer sometime.

I don't think I ever really hit 168-170 F in most of my mashes. Doesn't matter. I can hit 85-90% efficiency if I want to, without blinking. I mostly BIAB these days but for bigger batches I'm a batch sparger in a cooler, Dennybrew style.

Don't worry about tannins unless you're fly sparging a ton and don't control sparge pH. It's a pH thing, not temperature. Not even time and temperature, far as I know. Decoctions are often boiled for a whole hour. Tastes great. These are all old brewers tales that are totally false and might never die because it's in some old tome that everyone loves even though it's 40 years or more out of date and was never scientifically accurate.

 

I'm not surprised. IMO, mashing out has very little effect on efficiency. What it does is denature enzymes that would otherwise keep working to change the fermentability of the wort.

 

Good point, VikeMan. Then allow me to announce an average 80% apparent attenuation using US-05 mashed at 150 F for just 40 minutes with my process as well, and no noticeable attenuation problems with dozens of other yeasts either, again mashed at an average 150 F for 40-45 minutes, which I've been doing for almost every batch I've made for years and years. Perhaps I would achieve different (and less desirable!) results if I actually tried real hard to hit 168-170 F on every mash.

Mashouts are such wasted efforts IMO.

 

I don't mash out for most brews unless I'm looking for better lautering...but I wouldn't hesitate to use 190*F + water for batch sparging if mixed promptly. As long as the thermal mass itself doesn't go over 170*, imho.
Brewing a rye IPA tomorrow that I will mash out just for a little insurance/reassurance

 

You should get higher attenuation by not mashing out than with mashing out. So yes, if you don't want less attenuation than you are getting, but add a mashout step where you didn't have one before, and don't change anything else, you'll probably get less desirable results (assuming you were happy with the previous process' results). It's probably important to note that mashing out (or not) is just one of the mash factors affecting fermentability. Mash temp and length are others, and are generally more important.

Some people mash out in order to lock in the fermentability (sugar/dextrin profile) they want. That's why I do it. To me, it's more reliable (repeatable) than counting on the lauter time and/or time to reach a boil being consistent. But I would expect someone who doesn't mash out to have other (offsetting) parameters from me, if aiming for the same beer.

 

I mash out, then add sparge water because I'm dumb and haven't nailed my mash tun losses, or simply don't trust my own notes. I've added too hot sparge water and too much sparge water in previous years. Tannin extraction sux.

 

No mash out. I use a round cooler and fly sparge at 180 degrees. no issues that I am aware of. I do not worry about hitting an exact target. I make beer for myself and am happy with the results.

 

This right here is the bottom line. If you're happy with your results, then there's no need to change a damn thing.