Moving late additions into the whirlpool

First, as a data point on "kettle hops" terminology, someone asked Nate if he considers "kettle hops" whirlpool. He said no. I've always thought of them as boiled hops as well.

Second, I don't think I've ever gotten the depth or range of flavor from WP only beers. I always drink it wishing for more. My best beers have always come with charges in some variation of 15/10/5. I've felt this so much so, my next brew is going to completely omit FO/WP. I'll just be pushing those to DH. It's really made me wonder if the term WP really translates well to the homebrew scale. Just my opinion...

 

Your recipe looks ok to me. I’ve tried skipping a buttering addition but have found those beers lacking. I often go with 60 min and whirlpool now. But one of the best hoppy beers I ever brewed was the averagely perfect aipa in the recipe forum and that had 60, 15, 10, 5, and fo or WP additions, plus dry hops. But you need to decide for yourself what the best approach is for you. There are so many ways to make beer that is fundamentally good. Awesome so often boils down to personal preference.

 

I like some bitter/butter addition myself

 

Sigh. Such a tragically unfortunate typographical error. Clearly we need a new keyboard layout for brewers, because having u and i right next to each other is doing no one any favors.

 

How did you perceive and like the results from hopping from that technique?

For my NEIPAs I usually add a small 10 min addition and a large WP<170f. I like the results. Big citrus/tropical with subdued bitterness.

 

Your recipe looks good.

Jesus routinely likes more hops, that is his taste.

I brewed the 2 hearted. Lone . It was excellent and hoppy.

I'd brew it your way and keep notes. If you want more hops add them next time, or split the brew and dry hop more in one fermenter.

 

I do use boil hops. At start of boil, 15 minutes, whirlpool. I’ve only strayed from kettle additions at for ipas beyond bittering addition and 15. For Belgians I routinely do 60,30,15.

 

Hmm, it appears that you are an old fogy too!?!

Cheers!

 

I was at a brewery last week and for at least one of their very popular NEIPAs they use a small amount Munich. Scaling it to the recipe in the OP it would be about 1/2 pound of Munich instead of a whole pound. I know a NEIPA is not what you're going for, but I figure it's not completely off the mark.

These "younger" breweries seem to be going heavy on the whirlpool/flameout hops with the understanding that with this method they would be getting more flavor and aroma and less bitterness from the hops. The market seems to like the flavor and aroma of hops, but not necessarily the bitterness, so their method makes sense. Basically do most of the bittering at the beginning of the boil, toss some in with about 10-20 minutes left, but add the bulk of hops in the whirlpool or dry hopping.

 

But there is some flavor benefit for boiling the hops (even for a short period of time). For example, boiling will free up bound thiols and to quote Stan Hieronymus:

“Thiols make up less than 1% of the essential oils in a hops cone but might hold a key to the fashionable in-demand tropical flavors.”

Cheers!

 

Definatly flavor additions when boiling hops, some good some not.

 

IDK, I get plenty of bitterness with only whirlpool and DH additions. Depends how much you add.

 

Sounds expensive... ask me how I know.

 

Great MBAA podcast from last March with Ben Edmunds from Breakside that I’d highly recommmend.

Talks a lot about hoppy beers.

One little nugget is he specifically talks about how he thinks Citra is much more tropical as a 5 or 10 minute addition as opposed to a whirlpool addition. He talks about using different varieties at different times to get a specific flavor or aroma instead of just blending all varieties at one time.

Lots of other great info in there too

 

Any mention that this is because the boiling will free up bound thiols?

Cheers!

 

No mention but that’s what I would attribute it to. Also reducing the catty thiol (4mmp I think) which decreases when boiled.

 

FWIW I do a single kettle hop addition at 5 minutes with great results. I think it’s fairly dependent on the hop variety though.for instance I don’t like Ella as a boil hop but I like it as a Dryhop.

 

Yes, boiling hops will definitely add flavor, and often different flavors from the same hops than if they were in the whirlpool or dry hopped. I want to say that the last time couple times I used Polaris the resulting aroma was different depending on when it was added. I'll have to look more into thiols, they sound interesting.