New MA Growler Law/Advisory

Discussion in 'New England' started by seanwhite, May 25, 2017.

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  1. seanwhite

    seanwhite Initiate (0) Jan 31, 2008 Massachusetts

    Interesting news, via a facebook post from Navigation Brewing in Lowell and a Biz Journal article. In summary - ABCC sent an advisory stating that breweries can accept blank growlers of any size (as long as size is marked) in addition to breweries own branded growlers.

    I think this is a bit confusing. Will breweries be forced to accept blank growlers or just now have the option to do it? I assume as more consumers find out, the pressure would mount for brewers to accept blank growlers, and possibly all/most would shift to selling blank growlers. Does it have to be blank or just the old logos covered? I cannot actually find the advisory yet, as the ABCC has only posted up to 2016.

    I might as well buy a pallet of blank growlers an sell them outside of breweries.

    The growler law in MA is pretty contentious and I am all for making it easier for consumers to use any "clean" vessel to fill beer, but I am not sure if this is the best result.....

    http://www.bizjournals.com/boston/n...mass-breweries-will-let-you-fill.html?ana=fbk

    Good News! A new Massachusetts law now allows us to fill BLANK growlers in addition to our own branded growlers. One detail to point out, the article reads that any type of growler can be filled however the law reads glass. Anyway, moving forward Navigation Brewing Co. will fill BLANK 750ml, 32oz, and 64oz growlers in addition to our branded growlers. Please note your personal growler must have its size marked clearly and more importantly it must be clean. #cabinetspace#growlerlaw
     
    #1 seanwhite, May 25, 2017
  2. TheBirdSanc

    TheBirdSanc Initiate (0) May 23, 2012 Massachusetts

    #2 TheBirdSanc, May 25, 2017
    ManapuaMan, gclaw4444, cmurphycode and 1 other person like this.
  3. jageraholic

    jageraholic Pooh-Bah (1,632) Sep 16, 2009 Massachusetts
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    What a pain in the ass, just have them fill any clean growler and breweries can slap a sticker on it if they want to.
     
    #3 jageraholic, May 25, 2017
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  4. Rysk22

    Rysk22 Savant (1,240) Nov 12, 2014 Massachusetts
    Trader

    I suppose this is a good step but it's still a stupid rule. The Mass ABCC just can't get this right...
     
    #4 Rysk22, May 25, 2017
  5. Auror

    Auror Pooh-Bah (1,641) Jan 1, 2010 Massachusetts
    Pooh-Bah

    Similar to the NH interpretation of the law now.
     
    #5 Auror, May 25, 2017
  6. emannths

    emannths Initiate (0) Sep 21, 2007 Massachusetts

    @masterob8 can you post a copy of the advisory? Did this come up at the Waltham task force meeting?
     
    #6 emannths, May 25, 2017
  7. jjamilkowski

    jjamilkowski Initiate (0) Mar 8, 2013 Massachusetts
    Trader

    Looks like this is the advisory:
    http://www.mass.gov/abcc/pdf/2017Advisories/5-24-17AdvisoryRefillingGrowlers.pdf


    "Two types of growlers may be sold in Massachusett 'bottle growlers' and 'large glass growlers'. A growler is a 'bottle growler' when the brewer fills the container in advance of sale. A growler is a 'large glass growler' when a consumer uses the container to make a purchase and the brewer then fills the container. This Advisory only relates to large glass growlers, and not bottle growlers"

    They specifically mention glass which is unfortunate.
     
    #7 jjamilkowski, May 25, 2017
    Last edited: May 25, 2017
  8. emannths

    emannths Initiate (0) Sep 21, 2007 Massachusetts

    Clear as mud:
    Huh? How are those clauses related? Is the latter an example? A necessary condition? A sufficient condition? What if it has a label with the size, or surgeon general's warning but no logo? What if it has a logo from a company that's not a brewery? And what label, if any, must the filler affix?

    Jesus ABCC. Get your shit together.
     
    #8 emannths, May 25, 2017
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  9. Auror

    Auror Pooh-Bah (1,641) Jan 1, 2010 Massachusetts
    Pooh-Bah

    They literally only needed the 2nd clause.
     
    #9 Auror, May 25, 2017
  10. GabrielEVH

    GabrielEVH Initiate (0) Mar 24, 2016 Massachusetts

    Ya, more clarification is certainly needed on this.

    Sounds like breweries have the choice to now accept "large glass growlers" provided the conditions are met. Can we really expect many to do this since it isn't mandated?

    No sizes have been discussed. Is that up to the breweries?
     
    #10 GabrielEVH, May 25, 2017
  11. emannths

    emannths Initiate (0) Sep 21, 2007 Massachusetts

    No, it's not required. It is merely permitted.

    No. This only liberalized labeling requirements. Presumably if JA were to take your blank growler and run it through an autoclave then both Framingham and the MA ABCC would be ok with things.

    Yes, though pub breweries would be restricted to filling growlers no larger than 2 gallons due to existing Sec 19D restrictions.
     
    #11 emannths, May 25, 2017
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  12. seanwhite

    seanwhite Initiate (0) Jan 31, 2008 Massachusetts

    I wonder if this is a re-characterization of the existing law and this advisory clarifies it, until the task force issues guidance for a larger change? With the larger change, hopefully just being a simplification.

    All brewers can fill any vessel as long as it has surgeon general warning. It is up to discretion of each licensed brewer, on whether they will accept a vessel.
     
    #12 seanwhite, May 25, 2017
  13. krantul

    krantul Zealot (672) May 18, 2005 Massachusetts

    The TTB only requires that pre-filled growlers bear the standard ABLA information. Doesn't actually apply to fill-to-order growlers.

    One concern we have about the rule is that our own growlers are pressure rated. We counter-pressure fill everything on a Gruber, and have observed that cheap glass stands a high chance of detonating during the purge.
     
    #13 krantul, May 25, 2017
  14. Rysk22

    Rysk22 Savant (1,240) Nov 12, 2014 Massachusetts
    Trader

    Fortunately we all have blank glass growlers ready to be filled...
     
    #14 Rysk22, May 25, 2017
  15. seanwhite

    seanwhite Initiate (0) Jan 31, 2008 Massachusetts

    Owner of a homebrew shop got some clarification on the advisory:

    Glass and stainless are acceptable. The container must be blank when it arrives for a fill, cannot have labels, and cannot post anything over old labels. Volume/size must be marked on container. The container can have the growler manufacturer name, but no brewery name logo (WTF ARE THEY SAVING US FROM?). Government warning is not required. Brewers should use a sticker that can be removed, or tag/label
     
    #15 seanwhite, May 26, 2017
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  16. yuppiescum

    yuppiescum Zealot (519) Jun 4, 2009 Massachusetts

    Seems like a pretty big win. Anybody have luck erasing logos from glass? A little nail polish remover perhaps?
     
    #16 yuppiescum, May 26, 2017
  17. krantul

    krantul Zealot (672) May 18, 2005 Massachusetts

    Depends on the composition of the screen printing, but soaking in Star San solution will usually weaken the paint enough that it can be scrubbed off. May take a few soakings to complete, but at least the solution is hand safe. Much less safe is CLR, which was a common trick for removing Red Stripe paint, but that's nasty stuff.
     
    #17 krantul, May 27, 2017
  18. Sweatshirt

    Sweatshirt Initiate (0) Jan 27, 2014 New Hampshire

    I will wait to see who will choose to participate in filling blank growlers before scrubbing any clean. There was enough push back and town health code laws that I don't see this making a real difference.
     
    #18 Sweatshirt, May 27, 2017
  19. Resuin

    Resuin Pooh-Bah (2,921) Jun 18, 2012 Massachusetts
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Why are they not allowing labels on growlers? Is it arbitrary?
     
    #19 Resuin, May 27, 2017
  20. hobbitz

    hobbitz Crusader (455) Jun 17, 2010 Rhode Island

    Can people sharpie the size on them?
     
    #20 hobbitz, May 27, 2017
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