Northeast Pales/IPA/DIPA

I could not say for sure whether it is total oil or specific oils that cause the haze.

 

Yeah, I don't know how much hops were added to, say, Hill Farmstead's Citra versus Hill Farmstead's Cascade. My assumption is that they used similar hopping rates, because I assume the point of those single hopped brews was to showcase what happens when the only thing you change is the hops, but maybe they didn't.

 

I certainly would not know that either, but comparing pictures:

https://untappd.com/b/hill-farmstead-brewery-cascade-single-hop-pale-ale/1039559/photos

https://untappd.com/b/hill-farmstead-brewery-citra-single-hop-pale-ale/12210/photos

It looks like the citra is (maybe?) slightly more opaque. Not sure if that is due to just the different hops or different rates as well.

 

Matt

I will be homebrewing a Trillium Fort Point Pale Ale clone in a few months and that recipe (from BYO) calls for 5 ounces of dry hops. So the difference between 4 ounces and 5 ounces is not drastic.

As regards hops and total oil, below is information from the Stan Hieronymus book on Hops:

· Amarillo: 1.5 – 1.9%

· Centennial: 1.5 – 2.3%

· Citra: 2.2 – 2.8%

· Columbus: 2 – 3 %

· Simcoe: 2 – 2.5%

Total hop oil content will vary based upon the hop crop but the entire hop verities listed above have comparable total oil content.

Cheers!

 

So what is your point Jack? I am contending that more hops with higher oil content will cause haze. Yes, nonflocculant yeast, process, and adjuncts will increase the chances of haze, but are not explicitly required. I have proved it. None of this is particularly surprising. Is your point that there is some sort of magic trick that results in the haze?

Also:
1 oz of each of your hops in 5 gallons would result in (on average) 1.7 + 1.9 + 2.5 + 2.25 = 8.35% oil in 5 gallons
4 oz of Citra and 1 oz Columbus in 5 gallons would result in (on average) 5 x 2.5% = 12.5% oil in 5 gallons

12.5 / 8.35 = 50% more oil in one versus the other, which I would consider to be "drastic". Again, depends on the type of hop as well as the quantity.

 

Matt, I have already expressed my point previously that I think there is 'more' to obtaining murky/opaque than just dry hopping. Is the 'more' a specific yeast strain that wants to bind to hop 'stuff'? Is the 'more' the use of adjuncts like oats? Is the 'more' a specific brewing process aspect? Is the 'more' a combination of all three previous mentioned items? I really don't know. Just expressing my opinion just like you expressed your opinion in your first post in this thread.

I hope you have a Merry Christmas.

Cheers!

 

Got it Jack, thanks. But this is more than opinion. It is proven. If the hopping rate is enough, you will get the appearance desired regardless of yeast, or adjuncts. It is process related as well though. Do not add any fining agents to your beer. Again, I don't think I'm saying anything groundbreaking here. You have a happy holiday as well!

 

I certainly agree with that, getting back to your example of "I am guessing if you added 40 oz of Tettnang to 5 gallons of beer it would be pretty freaking hazy".

I am still unsure that 5 ounces of dry hopping for a 5 gallon batch will solely by itself get the level of murky/opaque that commercial breweries like Trillium and Tree House achieve. I will know more in a few months once I homebrew my batch of Trillium Fort Point Pale Ale. I suppose that 50% more total oil content could be the 'trick' but at this point in time I am unconvinced.

Cheers!

 

To put some things in to perspective, JC from Trillium once said they use 6 oz of dry hop per 5 gallons of beer. Something to think about. Maine Dinner is dry hopped for a month too. Different methods can yield similar things.

 

Are you sure that Maine dry hops for that duration?

Linked below is a clone recipe for Maine Dinner which lists:

“Rack to keg or secondary and age for 6 weeks. Add dry hops for the last 7 days.”

Maybe Maine conducts an extended secondary (one month) but only dry hops at the end of that secondary?

Cheers!

http://www.craftedpours.com/homebrew-recipe/maine-beer-dinner-double-ipa-clone-homebrew-recipe

 

Almost every IPA I brew is murky initially...it's just a question of how long the yeast/hop residue takes to flocc, how long I let it condition, and how fast I kick the keg. I'm probably out in left field on this one, but I like a compromise of hop aroma and a properly conditioned IPA.

 

Barry, what does "properly conditioned" mean to you?

Cheers!

 

Usually ~4 weeks in the cold keg, but every IPA/XPA is different, IMHO

 

Also...properly conditioned when I stop thinking it will be better next week

 

Some hops produce more haze than others. This is determined by the ratio of polyphenols to alpha acids. Also known as the haze index. Lower ratios produce less haze.

 

Barry, I do not keg but I experience a very similar 'effect' with my bottled IPAs.

Last night I had my first bottle of a recent Simcoe/Amarillo IPA batch; that beer was two weeks after bottling. It was fully carbonated with a BIG hop aroma/flavor but it was not tasting just 'right'. In another week or two this beer will reach its peak of aroma/flavor. Lots of folks opine that hoppy beers like IPAs should be consumed sooner rather than later but it has been my consistent experience that my bottled IPAs reach their peak of flavor at around 4-5 weeks after packaging. Needless to say but these beers slowly 'die' from a hop aroma to flavor perspective over the remaining month to 2 months.

Cheers!

 

NE IPA gurus -- need some advice. Brewing a version Xmas day -- and was considering putting it in a pin cask and conditioning /serving as real ale. Wondering about whether I should fine the brew when I go to the cask as I normally would For a traditional real ale. I'm torn between trying to clarify the beer/tradition and just letting it fly in the cask/secondary in all its muddy glory. Question - if I fine -- will the beer clarify or get clearer (using British lll)? Will it effect the flavor/aroma (will be dry hopping in the cask)? Leaning towards not fining but wanted to get thoughts. Cheers all -- I've enjoyed reading this thread and others w /related topics -- and it has inspired me to get back into brewing.

 

IMO you have already answered your own question. If you want the beer to be 'muddy' why would you fine it?

Cheers!

 

It's all about getting the right kind of mud in your eye?

 

I can see that, er oh no I can't.

Cheers!