Over serving at craft beer spots

Great topic !!
I could speak forever as a major consumption Master over many years that paid the price , but thankfully never injuring anyone except myself and family (financially) and more

I really don't drink outside my home any longer , but relating my past current experiences, most bartenders do try to do a juggling act .
I have been flagged many times when I was younger and thanked the baretender instead of getting upset as many do .
Recently I stopped at a craft brewery very close to home (5 mins) and I know to be careful .
I drink mostly the highest abv brews , so we all know I'm not only looking for taste , bit also the buzz .
The bartender immediately let me know upon serving me that these were +9 abv brews .
I respect that now that I'm older with a family, but I did let him know that I had 14 abv waiting for me at home , so he didn't feel uncomfortable.

Three shorties and I was out the door

My Dad owned bars and with today's laws I totally respect a bartenders choice to serve or not to .
It's a tough situation, but always better to side with being cautious .
Even if the customer gets mad the odds are they won't remember the next day anyway .

Both patron and bartender need to use common sense

CHEERS B!!

 

An experienced bartender should know when to cut someone off, but everyone is 100% responsible for how much they drink. It's the bartender's job to serve people alcohol and the individual should be adult enough to cut themselves off. I realize this isn't the way things always work though. It's another case of irresponsible immature people making life difficult for everyone else.

 

If you see something. Say something. If it involves calling out the obvious, such as the bartender has created a situation with these patrons which you don't feel comfortable driving home around. Do it. Or, call out the drinker and be very obvious. "You look shitfaced. You gonna get home like that alright?"

 

Yeah, I think the math on how many beers people can handle needs to be rewritten. 6.5%+ is the new norm, which for many people is a 50% jump from what they used to drink at bars.

But this is also on servers/bartenders. Had lunch at The Merchant in boston yesterday. Coworker orders a Guinness, waiter comes back says they're out of it but "the bartender recommended Yeti. It's a stout and pretty similar to Guinness." I stepped in with a heads up "that's a lot stronger" warning. Yeti comes out, served in a full pint. Totally irresponsible on their part, especially at lunch.

 

Bartenders should be vigilant and make sure not to do this when it's obvious.

 

Pretty sure that anyone serving alcohol in VA has to go through either TIPS, MART or RSVP training in order to be listed as an "ABC manager". Training addresses this issue specifically; if you, as a server, observe someone who appears to be impaired, the establishment can lose their license if you continue to serve them, or worse (criminal negligence for anything said drunky drunk does to another human...or horse...or property in general..)

Here's a likely problem I see though - lots of brewpubs popping up that aren't savvy in "bar or nightclub" management, so they hire whatever neckbeard (whoa, did I generalize? Sorry...) applies that has some interest or knowledge in beer, regardless of their actual ability to manage a situation. Now take young neckbeard and put him in the position of starting a potential confrontation. I've bartended, and it really, REALLY sucks to know you are instigating a "scene" that could turn ugly. And where I served, it very well could have turned ugly each time (a place called "The Dirty Shame"......do the math...). SO I can easily see how a lesser trained bartender could possibly stick their head in the sand and keep the good times goin'.

 

Haha. That seems pretty common a sports bars that specialize in wings and cheap beer; they'll have a few craft DIPAs, offering 16 or 32 oz pours.

I love it, but only because I know how much I am actually getting and think it is humorous.

 

It's definitely a problem that actually has a fairly easy solution, it would not add much to the training to tell them the abv and how big pours should be. @raynmoon i don't really find it humorous. I mean yes it could be considered funny because they are oblivious, but over serving can have very severe consequences. Imaging someone driving after having 2 32oz pours of 10%+ beer.

 

I'm not saying the humor is in over serving patrons. Im saying it's humorous how large the glass is compared to what I'm used to.

 

where are these places serving 24/32oz of anything?

People shouldn't be driving after 2 32oz pours of any beer. But I get your point

 

I've done a helluva lot of bartending in my time, in different kinds of places. On any given Friday or Saturday night I would bet 75% of the patrons would be "legally" drunk. These were old style neighborhood bars with mostly regular customers. Most everyone handles their drinking fairly well, knowing some semblance of a decent "public" limit. A few chronic public drunks would occasionally appear, possibly cause a stir, become rude, fall down, etc. I would never serve these characters. One place that I ran literally had a self-governing don't make too big fool of yourself ethic.....not being served, being ignored, sometimes being tossed out on their ear were options 1, 2, and 3. Budweiser or Beck's Dark (best option then), drunk is drunk.

 

I saw this more so when I was younger, but that's probably partly due to almost never being out at a bar now past 8pm.

 

Love that they use the term "dram shop". So 18th century.

 

I was reasonably drunk at Modern Times on Sunday. I wasn't being a dick but the same bartender had served me every drink and he could do the math on what all those 14% stouts were adding up to for my night. Now I wasn't driving anywhere, I had a hotel literally one block away and I wasn't yelling at strangers or falling asleep or spilling any beers but I was 3/4 of the way to a mighty big hangover. He never cut me off, he just avoided me on his rounds to get new drinks and I took the hint. I do recall thinking it was unusual for people to stop serving me... as I do get quite drunk at breweries if circumstances will allow me to do so without putting anyone in danger.

I wanted to make him feel bad for ignoring me so I left a $20 tip on a $38 tab.
THAT'LL SHOW HIM!!!!!

 

Given the dependence of the law and legal type folks on precedent, it can probably be traced back as being in continuous use since then.

 

I agree these laws are probably a good idea, but I wouldn't want to be a bartender and be responsible for enforcing them.

Sure, there are some easy cases where some people can barely stand up or speak. But as rgordon points out, there are a lot of people who get drunk and look fine. Do most of the laws have some variation of the phrase "visibly intoxicated"?

If so, what are you supposed to do with someone you know is most likely over the limit, but looks just fine? E.g. you have personally served a skinny dude six pints of 8% beer in two hours, but he's not stumbling or slurring?

Also, I wonder how many of the laws have some sort of qualifier "if you have good reason to believe they will be driving". If your customer is known to take the bus or a cab, can you serve him/her more?

Another issue is (and I am speculating here), don't many bars make well over 50% of their money from a small group people (5% or 10%) who drink a ton? If you cut these people off, you wouldn't be able to make a profit. The incentives are all wrong. "Let's see, this guy is pretty obviously drunk, but he's a regular, usually buying $20 pours of scotch and tipping quite well, and I have no reason to think he's driving home. Should I cut him off?"


Edit: ha just looked up Wisconsin's law. They have the opposite law: you can't sue a bartender. Strangely, I think over-serving is still against the law (a separate law), people just can't sue you in a civil suit for damages. Leave it to Wisconsin to protect the bars

125.035  Civil liability exemption: furnishing alcohol beverages.
(2) A person is immune from civil liability arising out of the act of procuring alcohol beverages for or selling, dispensing or giving away alcohol beverages to another person.

 

I appreciate the intent of these laws, but I feel like they can sometimes put bartenders in a difficult position. I'm sure many people would be too drunk to drive long before they would be visibly drunk enough for a bartender to notice.

 

I was at Caledonian in Edinburgh recently doing some pretend brewing. Some people from Heineken were there filming a segment for an in-house show. When we were doing a bit in the bar the brewery staff told one of them not to stand behind the bar with their glass because drinking behind the bar is illegal in Scotland. Didn't know that. Definitely not the case in England.

 

I would agree, but 64 oz of bud light over a 3 hour period and you might not be that intoxicated the same can't be said for the high abv beers.