Pilsner Fermentation...HELP!

Discussion in 'Homebrewing' started by MrLawrenceLady, Jun 2, 2014.

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  1. MrLawrenceLady

    MrLawrenceLady Initiate (0) Jun 2, 2014 Kansas

    It was a five gallon batch and I pitched one tube of yeast from White Labs.
     
  2. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    That's not ideal. But it will still make beer.
     
  3. MLucky

    MLucky Initiate (0) Jul 31, 2010 California

    That's underpitching by a fairly considerable margin. A typical pilsner would need something around 350B cells. Depending on the age of the vial, you probably pitched something like 80-100B. You needed something like 4 vials if you didn't want to make a starter. So there's that.

    As for the temp, it shouldn't be much of a problem. I often pitch lagers at ~44F, then let the temp rise to 48F for primary fermentation. The yeast would be sluggish at 42, but there should be some activity. But given the combo of the small amount of yeast and low temp you could have very little to no activity, especially if the wort was not properly aerated.

    But go ahead and warm it up to 50 or so, and pitch some more yeast if you can.
     
  4. reverseapachemaster

    reverseapachemaster Zealot (722) Sep 21, 2012 Texas

    I would warm it up closer to the top of the temperature range for the yeast to give them an easier time getting started, especially with the underpitching. I'd also think about pitching a second (and third) tube of yeast once you warm it up.
     
  5. markdrinksbeer

    markdrinksbeer Initiate (0) Nov 14, 2013 Massachusetts

    Ive noticed a few times the mention of underpitching.... for the OP's case, I assume she used an extract kit, so why would they have her totally underpitch her yeast? Seems like most kits (i've done about a half dozen myself) only use one packet or one vial of yeast. After reading these forums, one packet or one vial is almost ALWAYS said to be under pitching.

    So are the popular extract kit retailers doing something wrong by including far too little yeast?
     
    bushycook likes this.
  6. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    It's not that the kit manufacturers aren't including enough yeast per se. One vial is enough from which to make a proper sized yeast starter, either single step or multistep (when needed for lagers and/or high gravity beers).
     
  7. pweis909

    pweis909 Grand Pooh-Bah (3,250) Aug 13, 2005 Wisconsin
    Pooh-Bah

    I suppose it is debatable, but I would say that kit retailers and yeast manufacturers have always been a bit misleading on this point. The single pack or tube of liquid yeast that they might sell with a kit is generally not the ideal amount for making a high quality beer. I think they might be concerned that the extra step of making a starter or the added cost of extra packs of yeast would deter some of the newbies who use kits. But I would think making poor beer is likely to deter people too.
     
  8. MLucky

    MLucky Initiate (0) Jul 31, 2010 California

    This is an arguable point, since people differ regarding their standards for pitch rates. Bearing in mind that this is only my opinion, I would say: yes.

    One thing to understand is that there's a big difference between one packet and one vial. A vial or smack pack of liquid yeast typically is manufactured with about 100 billion cells, and they gradually die off at a rate determined largely by the storage conditions. A package of dry yeast is usually 200-300 billion cells, and keeps longer.

    In pitching a 5 gallon batch of a typical ale (ie, one of roughly 1.050 OG), you need somewhere around 180 billion cells. One package of dry yeast would be plenty. One vial of liquid would be not enough. (Now, by "not enough" what I really mean is "less than ideal." Which is to say, the yeast would probably still ferment the beer, but it would be stressed, and it would be more likely to produce off flavors and/or fail to fully attenuate.)

    In pitching a typical lager, the problem is exacerbated, because the amount of yeast needed is much higher: about double what you'd need for an ale with the same OG. While you could get by with a single pack of dry yeast, you would be pitching only about 25% of the optimal amount if you used on vial of liquid yeast. Because a clean fermentation character is essential to most lager styles, the resulting off flavors would probably be a significant problem. I mean, it will be beer, but it will not taste like a fine pilsner (or helles or whatever).

    So, yes, in my opinion, yeast manufacturers and retailers do their customers a disservice when they suggest one vial is adequate. When dealing with beginning brewers, they should recommend dry yeast, or teach them how to make a starter.
     
    jbakajust1 and markdrinksbeer like this.
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