Poor Canning Practices or a Fridge on the Ropes?

Discussion in 'Beer Talk' started by sportscrazed2, Jan 24, 2021.

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  1. sportscrazed2

    sportscrazed2 Pooh-Bah (2,360) Mar 29, 2010 American Samoa
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Opened my fridge to find this. It's not the first time this has happened to me but, it's been rare enough that I've ingored it. Is something wrong with my fridge? Too cold/warm? Did the canning process leave room for error?
    [​IMG]
     
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  2. zac16125

    zac16125 Grand Pooh-Bah (3,432) Jan 26, 2010 South Carolina
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    I have had this occur several times, and I’m certain there’s nothing wrong with my fridge.

    On a broader note, for all the love given to the transition to canning....I’m not a fan. It seems like I’ve come across WAY more issues with consistency in canned beers than I ever did with bottles. I know people pitch the benefits of cans; no light, no air, etc. But it seems like there are some quality control issues in place here.
     
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  3. PapaGoose03

    PapaGoose03 Grand High Pooh-Bah (6,057) May 30, 2005 Michigan
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah

    Did you buy this beer warm (off the store shelf) or from the cooler?

    I'm going to guess you bought it warm, and when it chilled in the fridge at home the liquid and air inside the can contracted. In short, I think you bought a 'short fill' that caused this. There's certainly not 16 ounces of beer in that can.
     
    #3 PapaGoose03, Jan 24, 2021
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2021
  4. sportscrazed2

    sportscrazed2 Pooh-Bah (2,360) Mar 29, 2010 American Samoa
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    I think it was warm but don’t remember at this point
     
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  5. officerbill

    officerbill Pooh-Bah (2,228) Feb 9, 2019 New York
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    I agree with @PapaGoose03
    The can couldn't have collapsed if it was full. If you haven't opened it yet do a slow pour into a measuring cup and see how much actual liquid was in there.
     
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  6. jesskidden

    jesskidden Grand Pooh-Bah (3,145) Aug 10, 2005 New Jersey
    Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    Better yet, just put it on a digital scale and weigh it and then compare it to the weight of an uncollapsed can. (Just for personal info - unnecessary for the next step to be completed).

    Then - depending on distance, cost, frequency of visiting the store, personal laziness and forgetfulness, etc.- bring it back and get a replacement or refund.
     
  7. nc41

    nc41 Initiate (0) Sep 25, 2008 North Carolina
    Trader

    New to me I’ve never seen that.
     
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  8. mmmbeerNY

    mmmbeerNY Maven (1,369) Mar 5, 2014 New York

    You got a leaky can, it can't be full. Although I've never seen one collapse
     
  9. BBThunderbolt

    BBThunderbolt Grand High Pooh-Bah (7,846) Sep 24, 2007 Kiribati
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    FWIW, at my work, we aim at 370+ grams for a 12oz can. Our cutoff for a lowfill, is 365 grams, 364, we drink it!

    Basic point stands, have a decent kitchen scale, and weigh any can you're not sure about.
     
  10. BBThunderbolt

    BBThunderbolt Grand High Pooh-Bah (7,846) Sep 24, 2007 Kiribati
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    That shouldn't make a notable difference. The amount of CO2 and beer should be the same, certainly not enough to cause this. My guess, is, a slow leak due to a bad seam. But, shrug.....
     
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  11. thebeers

    thebeers Grand Pooh-Bah (5,837) Sep 10, 2014 Pennsylvania
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    Is there any chance the can froze, then thawed? Sometimes a can at the back of an overcrowded fridge can freeze and the can will collapse in on itself when it thaws.
     
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  12. BillAfromSoCal

    BillAfromSoCal Pooh-Bah (2,415) Aug 24, 2020 California
    Society Pooh-Bah

    I have been thinking about this and I believe the "freeze/thaw" answer is correct and here is why: Freezing includes an increase in volume. For water that change is about 9%...a bit more depending on how cold below freezing it goes.. The increase in volume would be sufficient to cause the aluminum to be stressed beyond the yield strength, resulting in permanent plastic deformation of the aluminum can (diameter and length increase.) Then when the beer thaws the volume of fluid would decrease and the can would collapse as the external atmospheric pressure sufficiently exceeds the newly created internal partial vacuum. Oddly enough, an underfilled can would be less likely to have the problem since the larger than usual space above the liquid could accommodate more expansion of the liquid upon freezing.
     
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  13. BillAfromSoCal

    BillAfromSoCal Pooh-Bah (2,415) Aug 24, 2020 California
    Society Pooh-Bah

    Actually, I forgot to edit that before i posted it and my 15 minute edit time window expired... ~9% is the volume increase upon freezing of water. If it gets colder below freezing the volume would not further increase, so forget that i said that....
     
  14. thebeeremptor

    thebeeremptor Pundit (764) Aug 12, 2018 California
    BA4LYFE Society Trader

    Assuming your fridge isn't capable of freezing temps and is actually the cause as others have mentioned, a squish test is good practice when checking out beer. While it's not scientific by any stretch, a significant amount of give when squeezing the can means you're dealing with a short fill or a leaky can. Telltales signs of leaky cans are dried beer around the seal (top of the can) and being able to smell stale beer on the can/pack. For cans in a box, just press with a couple fingers on either side of the box at the same time in roughly the middle of the cans.

    Additionally, let the store/beer buyer know while you're still in the store; from a buyer's perspective, I would appreciate someone letting me know that information. It allows me to determine whether it was an isolated incident or I received a case of leaky beer that I can pull and notify my distributor to replace.
     
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  15. Reidrover

    Reidrover Grand Pooh-Bah (4,886) Jan 14, 2003 Oregon
    Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    Seen this before. With a lot of mobile canning going on nowadays the quality control ( low fills) is not the best. Another thing is you could have had a pinhole leak. But that would be noticable.
     
  16. Rug

    Rug Grand Pooh-Bah (3,454) Aug 20, 2018 Massachusetts
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Came here to say this. I've had this happen twice before and that was my justification. Always nice to hear someone justify these things with engineering/material science knowledge :slight_smile:
     
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  17. zid

    zid Grand Pooh-Bah (3,132) Feb 15, 2010 New York
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    In order to get a good answer, I think you'll have to be more specific regarding the above statement.
     
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  18. bubseymour

    bubseymour Grand Pooh-Bah (4,800) Oct 30, 2010 Maryland
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Never had this problem before and have not noticed anywhere yet. Is it common from this one brewer or more widespread amongst other brewers? Right now I’m going with the freeze / thaw theory as most likely reason.
     
  19. honkey

    honkey Maven (1,350) Aug 28, 2010 Arizona
    Trader

    It most likely has more to do with significantly more, (often inexperienced) breweries packaging. It’s not inherently a can problem. Packaging lines also take some time to learn even for experienced breweries and with more companies selling lines now, a lot of the learning curve is extended since the product testing is really falling on the brewers. Add into account the mobile business and you have a lot of factors that make this make more sense.
     
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  20. nc41

    nc41 Initiate (0) Sep 25, 2008 North Carolina
    Trader

    As a freezer of many many beers, one this week, I’ve never seen that happen, sometimes you get lucky when it thaws out its still good, sometimes it’s flat, sometimes you have a beer mess when the can bursts. Never seen a collapsed can though.
     
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