Possible Bad Trader Nmelione

Sorry to hear Capn...But you gotta hit the trade request button..Also, what say you @Nmelione ? why would you just screw someone like that? Extremely bad form, and to just block him and leave a conversation? Would really like to hear your side

 

Would be great for him to show up here and offer his side of story.

It sucks when trades fall through but you should be able to trade those Plinys very easily.

 

I think @Nmelione will go on folks DNT lists now, but not much you can do here due to no formal trade request and you aren't really out beer. Yes, technically you are out money, and the guy obviously flaked. But he blocked you, that has to say something about where this is now, yes?

 

• Was the trade conducted on BeerAdvocate?
• Is your trade partner's account verified?
• Did you use the Feedback System?
• Was beer shipped, either by you or the trade partner?
• Have you given them a chance to make it right?
• Have you exhausted all methods of contact?

If you answered NO to any of the above, don't post a bad trader thread. (Exception: It Forward threads, in some cases.)

 

@F2brewers Not sure if you saw this seems pretty similar to a grey 'didn't have a formal trade' bad trader thread from a few weeks back.
Just wanted to bring to your attention, since in that case you posted the link to the traders profile and did a 'will delete when resolved' half way measure.

 

@CapnTrav - a somewhat similar post came up a few weeks back where the trade was over text (not a formal trade in the system) so I just flagged the Mod who dealt with that one.

I had originally thought 'well no trade, that sucks but nothing to be done' and that wasn't the case. @F2brewers trades actively, and at least from what I have seen does not take any crap from people ducking the rules or shirking their trade promises. Hopefully he can help.

Since you are out of pocket buying beers to order for a trade, and everything was agreed with the exception of the final trade request click, then this seems borderline, and perhaps the Mods can at least tag the other person and ask them to explain in the thread.

 

Thanks for the tag.

@CapnTrav you really *do* need to use the feedback system.

That's the piece that puts this in the grey area. OTOH, the above list doesn't appear to address this kind of situation/IP trade. Plus, if there BA conversations, we do have some record of what happened.

For now, I'm fine with this thread. The truth behind what happened needs to come out to protect other traders.

@Nmelione What's the situation, captain? (Spoken in my best General Grievous voice). You need to respond or your account will be in jeopardy.

I've posted a link to this thread on your profile until this is resolved.

 

@F2brewers - no worries, glad you could help even though it is a bit grey.

 

At some point I would think if people don't use the BA trade feedback system it will need to be a 'tough break' situation. As long as they keep getting bailed out and helped when stood up and/or cheated there's no real incentive to use it.

That being said it's still no reason for @Nmelione to do what he did. This type of behavior puts a black eye on the good people who travel and meet up with other BAs to share a handshake and beer. I see he was just on 6 minutes ago, hopefully he answers.

 

I had shared a roughly similar opinion (said as much), and was quite thoroughly schooled by @F2brewers last time this came up - The principle that people aren't exploiting the BA trading system is followed more than the strict letter of the law in the rules which in hindsight from the last time this came up is a good thing.

Rules are rules, and we are all adults, so I agree, there needs to be some sort of line, and responsibility ultimately falls with the trader for not going through the system, but particularly for IP trades (where you are never at risk of being ripped off really) it is a bit more grey as it seems the system was more designed for mail trades.

 

Yep, we see that @Nmelione has been on very recently. Please show up on this thread and offer your side of the story.

 

@CapnTrav: if Nmelione would have messaged you saying he couldn't pick up the beer and he's sorry but gonna have to cancel the trade, would this have alleviated be situation? It seems this is the only thing missing from making this a normal trade that fell through especially since you didn't use the feedback system. Radio silent conversations unfortunately happen all the time and these individuals go on my personal DNT list, but I never publicly out them. I understand it would be beneficial for the community to know, but we have to draw the line somewhere and that line has been drawn at actually losing beer.

@pagriley: is the previous thread you mentioned the one where the traders had previously completed a trade on BA, but didn't use the feedback system for their 2nd trade? If so, I believe this fell into the grey area since an actually trade using the feedback system had been logged at one point in time.

It's also a lesson to all of us to not set up trades until the beer is actually in our possession or at least fully communicate that the trade is pending successfully acquiring the beer.

All that being said, my biggest pet peeve is when people don't even have the decency to respond letting you know a trade is not going to happen. So I feel your pain but this IMO is in no way a bad trader thread.

 

This is a good checklist, but I don't think it takes into account for some genuine exceptions. In this case, the OP clearly got screwed without as much as an "I'm sorry" and simply left conversation and blocked user. No reasonable person would want to trade with @Nmelione in the future (maybe that's why he doesn't care to respond) with that sort of personal conduct. Fact of the matter is that people don't make and accept trade requests until beers are secured. Even if the OP made the request, it won't be accepted until @Nmelione secures the beer. Just about the only thing that could have been done differently was to submit a trade request AND have it accepted before going out to pick up the beers. I'm glad @F2brewers left this up.

 

@TmKeisySC - yep that is the one - I agree, a different situation.

This trade was set up using the BM system and was in response to an ISO, so still a grey area I guess. That is the problem with grey - there are a lot of shades (50 of them apparently. Who knew?).

I think your last point is the main issue - the beer was in the OP's possession, and when a trader tracks down and buys beer for someone to order, and then they back out, that really isn't acceptable. Even if the other trader sends an apology that they have to back out, the OP is still out of pocket at what seems like the very last minute.

@mythaeus put it succinctly - the 'bad trader' check list is a good starting point, but there do need to be exceptions to out bad behavior.

 

@F2brewers Quick question: if Bad Trader Threads are ONLY allowed for BA trades that USED the Feedback system, why are they allowed at all? Aside from the person being screwed able to share their bad experience and possibly get help from other users, the feedback system will take care of this matter through Negative feedback.

Just curious. I'd think it would make sense that these threads are MORE useful for BA trades or BA users trading that DON'T have the ability to use the feedback system. Am I missing something?
I know that makes the validity of each thread a little more grey, but simply adjusting the requirements to having BOTH parties need to be actively ON BA and trading would be of enough merit to warn/protect the community.

Sorry if this should be a separate thread but this seemed like a good opportunity to ask. Cheers