Recipe Critique - Dubbel

Discussion in 'Homebrewing' started by carteravebrew, Nov 12, 2014.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. carteravebrew

    carteravebrew Initiate (0) Jan 21, 2010 Colorado

    Hi All,
    Looking to brew a Belgian Dubbel this weekend and would like a recipe critique. I want this to be fairly heavy on the "Belgiany" flavors...raisiny, toffee, slightly estery. Would also like a nice deep ruby color, if possible.

    My main question is on the sugar to use. Looks like my homebrew store has the Belgian candi sugars in solid form (both clear and dark) and liquid form (D-45 and D-90). Also, I have a bottle of Blackstrap molasses, which I thought could be an interesting alternative.

    Anywho...let me know what you think, particularly which sugar you'd recommend.

    5 gallons

    10 lbs Belgian Pilsner
    .5 Caramunich
    .5 Special B
    .5 Cara-Pils
    ~1 lb ??? sugar
    Noble hops to about 30 IBU's
    WLP500 Monastery Ale

    Mash @ ~151*F for 60 min w/ 1.25 qts/lb water
    O.G.: 1.060 (without sugar)
    Ferment around 70*F ambient
     
  2. Tebuken

    Tebuken Initiate (0) Jun 6, 2009 Argentina

    If you want raisiny flavor it would be necessary to raise Special B to 1 lb,IMHO.
    In regards sugar I think 1 lb is a good attempt, I would choose dark sugar for sure. Adding a .3 melanoidin malt will help to round a nice reddish beer color without adding any weird flavor.
    There´s no need to add cara-pils to this beer, instead I would mash it higher (about 155 F). Ferment a bit higher too , about 72-74 F .
    This beer will benefit from aging longer than lower-OG ones due some fusels production, they will turn into esters with time. It is very likely you will notice some bubble-gum flavor when this beer is young, it will slowly diminish while aging.
     
    #2 Tebuken, Nov 12, 2014
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2014
    carteravebrew likes this.
  3. MrOH

    MrOH Grand Pooh-Bah (3,995) Jul 5, 2010 Virginia
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah

    This is just me, but I'd drop the cara-pils. Maybe sub in a pound of munich, or a 1/4# of aromatic. Maybe a touch lighter on IBUs; maybe just 25 (splitting hairs). Go with the d-90, add after high krausen. Ferment on the low end for wlp500, it'll throw off a lot of banana at higher temps.
     
    carteravebrew likes this.
  4. Naugled

    Naugled Pooh-Bah (1,944) Sep 25, 2007 New York
    Pooh-Bah

    I've tried both the solid and liquid belgian sugars in dubbels. I think the liquid tastes better, but it's subtle, so I think you'll be happy with either. Both D45 or D90 are good choices.
     
    machalel and carteravebrew like this.
  5. pweis909

    pweis909 Grand Pooh-Bah (3,250) Aug 13, 2005 Wisconsin
    Pooh-Bah

    I have a dubbel recipe in the recipe section. Dark candi syrup is the way to go.
     
  6. jae

    jae Initiate (0) Feb 21, 2010 Washington

    Why the dextrin? As above, I'd add dark candi syrup.
     
  7. firstthenlast

    firstthenlast Initiate (0) Nov 25, 2013 Massachusetts

    I second this. 1.5lb pound of crystals is too much, the caravienne and special b are plenty (drop the carapils). I think that if you really want obvious belgian features you need to go with the aromatic and dark d90.
     
  8. carteravebrew

    carteravebrew Initiate (0) Jan 21, 2010 Colorado

    Body and head retention. Will likely drop and just mash a little higher for extra body. I know it's not exactly par for the Dubbel course, but I just prefer more body than what's typical in almost any style.
     
  9. hoptualBrew

    hoptualBrew Initiate (0) May 29, 2011 Florida

    What about 3-4% Flaked Wheat and high mash temp for body?
     
    jae likes this.
  10. carteravebrew

    carteravebrew Initiate (0) Jan 21, 2010 Colorado

    So, I'm not opposed to nixing the dextrin malt, but just for conversation's sake, why flaked wheat in place of dextrin? Sounds like they do the same thing body-wise, and the flaked wheat could possibly (though unlikely in that small of an amount) contribute a little flavor and haze. Is the flaked wheat more effective as a body enhancer?

    From Palmer's How to Brew:


    Dextrin Malt 3 L Also known as American Carapils, this malt is used sparingly and contributes little color but enhances the mouthfeel and perceived body of the beer. A common amount for a five gallon batch is 1/2 lb. Dextrin malt has no diastatic power. It must be mashed; if steeped it will contribute a lot of unconverted starch and cause starch haze.

    Flaked Wheat Unmalted wheat is a common ingredient in wheat beers, including: American Wheat, Bavarian Weisse, and is essential to Belgian Lambic and Wit. It adds starch haze and high levels of protein. Flaked wheat adds more wheat flavor "sharpness" than malted wheat. Use 0.5-2 lb. per 5 gal batch. Must be mashed with base malt.
     
  11. epic1856

    epic1856 Initiate (0) Aug 11, 2006 California

    I would nix the dextrin malt. You are planning on adding 1 lb of sugar which will thin out the body, but then you want to add dextrin to increase the body.
     
  12. carteravebrew

    carteravebrew Initiate (0) Jan 21, 2010 Colorado

    Alright, cara-pils nixed. Revised recipe below. Thanks for the suggestions!

    5 gallons

    10 lbs Belgian Pilsner
    .5 lb Caramunich
    .5 lb Special B
    .5 lb Aromatic
    1 lb D-90
    Noble hops to about 30 IBU's
    WLP500 Monastery Ale
    Mash @ ~154*F for 60 min w/ 1.25 qts/lb water
     
    #12 carteravebrew, Nov 13, 2014
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2014
    MrOH likes this.
  13. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,375) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Society Pooh-Bah

    If you are looking for a lot of Belgiany yeast character (prominent esters and phenols) I would strongly recommend Wyeast 3787 fermented warm (e.g., 72-73 degrees F).

    Cheers!
     
  14. carteravebrew

    carteravebrew Initiate (0) Jan 21, 2010 Colorado

    Have used the White Labs equivalent, WLP530, before and wasn't happy with it. Seemed a little restrained/subdued, and if memory serves correctly, I fermented in the low 70's. This line from White Labs description of WLP530 kind of pointed me to WLP500:

    "Used to produce Trappist style beers. Similar to WLP500, but is less fruity and more alcohol tolerant (up to 15% ABV)."
     
  15. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,375) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Society Pooh-Bah

    I have never used the White Labs version but I have used 3787 many times (40-50 times). What I have noticed with 3787 is that if you ferment on the cooler side (e.g., 60's) it will produce a more subdued beer. If you ferment over 70 it will produce much more esters and phenols. I always use 3787 for my house Belgian Ale (which is a Dubbel) and I always strive for a warm ferment. A few weeks ago I bottled a batch of my house Belgian Ale where I used 3787 and fermented around 72 degrees F. Plenty of fruity and spicy flavors in that beer! Wyeast 3787 has a recommended fermentation temperature that tops off at 78 degrees F. I would imagine that it has even more Belgiany Character if fermented hot. I have never fermented higher than 73 degrees F so I do not have personal experience here.

    I can't recommend 3787 enough for folks who what to produce a Belgian Ale with lots of Belgiany character.

    Cheers!

    Edit: Below is the Wyeast description of 3787:

    “A classic strain for brewing Belgian dubbel or Belgian tripel. This Abbey strain produces a nice balance of complex fruity esters and phenolics, making it desirable for use in other Belgian style ales as well. A flocculent, true top cropping yeast (additional headspace is recommended), that will work over a broad temperature range. This strain makes a great Belgian style “house” strain.”
     
  16. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    There's nothing wrong with WLP500 for a Dubbel. And FWIW, White Lab's own recommended Dubbel recipe uses it, though obviously you don't have to be a slave to the yeast manufacturer's recommendations.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.