RIMS/HERMS System Alternatives

I suppose it depends on whether you want to buy a complete system or put together the components yourself. Are you a do-it-yourself kinda guy, or do you just want to buy a completed system. I will tell you that if you are willing to buy components and do some work yourself you can build a system for about 20% of the cost of a Sabco Brew Magic, and it will be better. If you are interested I will give you a list of suppliers for components you'll need. There's no reason to bother if you aren't interested.

Also, I don't think MoreBeer's systems are what most would refer to as RIMS. They do recirculate. But they use direct fire gas heat, and that's not what we mean by RIMS. A RIMS system can hit the MLT with a gas flame, but the source of the heat during recirculation is an electric RIMS tube.

 

Okay, if you want to build the control systems:

I would recommend taking a look at the BCS controllers (BCS460 and BCS462) at embedded control concepts http://www.embeddedcc.com/ . I have made two control systems using these controllers. They are simple to wire and they provide a cool browser-based interface as well as an ipad/iphone app interface. You can connect directly to the unit from your computer/laptop using a CAT5/5e cable or add a wireless bridge and control it over the Internet (you have to use port forwarding on your home router to do this). The 460 has 4 inputs for temperature probes that can control 6 discrete outputs. It is kind of like having four Ranko controllers on steroids because you can write and save processes including steps, procedures wait-states Etc. The only thing is, you have to wire the relays yourself (They sell the relays, probes Etc on their site). The controller switches the relays (5V from the unit) and the relays switch the power on and off using either "differential" settings or a "PID" algorithms. You use differential control settings for controlling something like a freezer, and the PID settings for controlling your heating elements like the one in your RIMS tube.

The controllers can be used to automate almost the entire brewing session.

Think of a controller turning on the heat for your HLT
When the temperature reaches 168 it opens a solenoid ball-valve on the HLT (water then flows into the pump)
Waits 15 seconds for the pump to prime
Turns on your pump and pumps your strike water into the MLT
You get the idea.

It's a hobby in itself if you want to take it that far. Check out the forums on their site. Lots of great stories and pictures. I love the thing. I have not gone the automated valve route, but I control MLT Temperature, RIMS Element and can monitor temperatures and start processes over the Internet. I use it to start my HLT heating element when I'm at work , and I can mash in as soon as I get home. Picture below has my control system in the background.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/47583594@N08/6924118587/

The control systems are the two boxes at the top of the erector set looking structure. One contains the BCS controller and one houses the relays. The copper thing between the left and middle kettle is my current RIMS tube. The white wire coming from the RIMS tube is a temperature probe that monitors mash temperature as mash recirculates. The controller monitors temperature and turns heat on and off using PID to control mash temperature.

 

No prob. Not much on this site mentioned about these techniques. Send a beer mail if you have any other specific questions (I guess they still have beer mail?).

 

http://conical-fermenter.com/products/

has RIMS tube and HERMS HLT's. I use their tube

https://www.brewershardware.com/Tri-Clover-RIMS-Tube.html

Brewers hardware has a RIMS tube.

Blichmann is supposed to have a complete system ($$$$), some day.

 

WickedSluggy laying it out!! Kudos man!
I use the BCS 460 with the Brewer's Hardware RIMS tube. I built my own wooden stand (will try to get photos up soon). Another place to buy just the RIMS tube is http://www.brewhardware.com/rimsherms-parts
For complete stands, there are a lot of guys now welding stands together and selling them. Here are two decent sources:
http://www.homebrewtalk.com/vendors/
http://www.byo.com/resources/byo-classifieds

 

Wicked, I just picked up that same brew stand from the guy in Garland this weekend. Havnt used it yet, how do you like it?

 

That's cool you recognize his work. It's a first class brewstand and a pleasure to use. The only thing he might want to change, eventually, is the way the burners are mounted and vented. If you use converted Sanke kegs they work great, but the burners can't get enough airflow when you use conventional kettles. The work-around is pretty simple. He'll supply a welded grill device that raises the kettle slightly and that allows the air to circulate.

 

Yes, I love that Brewers Hardware RIMS tube, and it's cheaper than the replacement price you pay for the Sabco tube. However, it's one of those things that is so easy to make. I had to DIY my RIMS Tube - less than $30 including the element and quick disconnects.

 

Thanks Wicked, I never would have thought of that. I use a Keggle for my BK but a 20 gallon pot for my HLT so I will ask him about adding the welded grill device. I have not used it so he should be able to accommodate. He also told me that he normally doesnt put the center burner in them but would for an extra fee. Even though I still use a cooler for mashing I think I am gonna have him put it on just because I dont know if or when I will switch to a mash kettle! Thanks again and am glad I found someone who has used this exact stand.

 

He uses a cooler as a mash tun and runs a HERMS system.
I had him add the center burner. I could do without it and rely solely on the RIMS tube. But there are times when it makes sense to hit the mash tun with heat. Running a step mash using only on a RIMS tube to get from around 130F to 150F would take a while, particularly on cold days in the garage - not that we have that many cold days. Also, on cold days, the bottom can benefit from a burst of heat from time to time if the RIMS is running full on. That's true of the Sabco Brew Magic too, by the way.

The one thing I don't like about hitting the MT with a flame is that it "confuses" the temperature probe in my RIMS tube because the pickup tube that feeds it is obviously siphoning of freshly fired wort. This tells the PID to shut off the RIMS heating element. The good thing about it is that I know how hot I'm heating the wort where the fire is hitting it. The temperature probe on the side of the mash tun is a few inches above the bottom - it continues to get a more averaged out temperature read. For a minute I have a complex picture of my mash temperature. It evens out as it recirculates, and the PID controller soon gets the accurate temperature and starts switching the RIMS on again.

 

I will be honest, that seems a little confusing. I dont know if I will be getting into running a HERMS or RIMS system anytime soon. Sounds fascinating to me though. Thanks for the info and cant wait for the new stand to be done.!!

 

It's sounds complicated when I discuss it because I'm a simi-literate redneck. Let M.C. show you how HERMS all works. Or I'll show you RIMS when I've got some of the homebrew club guys around.

 

HERMS is easy...think of it as the opposite of wort chilling. In a HERMS system you're running colder wort through hot water effectively heating up the mash. Guys just use the Hot Liquor Tanks as the hot water and run the mash wort through an immersion chiller. Basically you need a pump, a HLT and a wort chiller.

 

Never thought of it that way. Again, thanks for the input!!

 

Sounds good!!

 

Hey guys, I've been reading and lurking for a while, but this post just made me join... ;-)
Wicked, can you share who built your frame ? Looks like you're close to where I live and I'm looking for someone to weld me one. I may try myself, but the wife is (rightfully) afraid I'll burn the house down....
Thanks for the help.