Saison yeasts and dryhopping

I’d pitch lacto for 16-24 hours then pitch a saison yeast. French saison yeast is 3711 which isn’t my favorite strain but I also don’t get any twang out of it.

 

For fruity esters, the Dupont strain(s) (like Wyeast 3724) is the way to go. I've never used it after Lactobacillus, so I can't guarantee that it will perform at low pH, but OTOH I don't know of any sacch strains that won't.

 

I just put a keg on tap that used Omega Yeast OYL42 which is very fruity and very slightly tart. I think it's supposed to be the same as Wyeast 3726. Interesting on its own but I think could work well with some lacto.

 

If you have used Wyeast 3724 before, how does the OYL42 (Blaugies?) compare.

 

I have not used 3724 in the past so can't make a comparison there. This is my first use of the Blaugies strain and am enjoying it, I get a lot of fruitiness, especially in the nose, but would compare it more to juicy fruit gum than any actual fruit. My saison is fairly simple and low gravity and this yeast makes an incredibly drinkable beer.

The beer is still very young so I expect a bit more maturation to take place and while it's enjoyable so far, I feel it is missing something. I am also looking to create my holy grail of saisons so I am being very nit picky.

 

What are the compounds that Brett creates that you’re allergic to? I’ve never heard of that.

Check out Saison yeast options from The Yeast Bay. They have some unique strains that might not be available elsewhere. I believe Drew Beecham did some Saison strain comparison. Might be worth looking into.

You could also try a non diastaticus Belgian strain you like and just add some enzymes to dry it out.

Or mix a small portion of Belle Saison in with a fruity strain you like. You’ll get the bone dry attenuation of French Saison with very little of its flavor profile.

 

I have tasted "hot dog" in beers made with european/mexican coriander. It might be a phenol. Can't say I've had that with 3724, which for me is quite fruity and low-ish (for a saison strain) in phenols,

 

Well, if you replaced the word "fruitiness" with "citrusy" what you described there would be the Wyeast French Saison strain (3711) for me. And for my palate Lallemand Belle Saison yeast seems very close to 3711.

A number of years ago I brewed a Hoppy Saison using the Belle Saison strain and I was happy with the resulting beer:

"I brewed a Hoppy Saison using Danstar Belle Saison Yeast and a total of 2 ounces of Amarillo for late hopping (flavor, end of boil & dry hopping). I used Warrior for bittering. I am happy with how this beer turned out but I was somewhat surprised that this beer required considerable bottle aging for the beer to really come together. My OG was 1.059 and FG was 1.001 (I used no sugar)."

I suspect the above batch was modestly hopped vs. what you are intending to do here.

Cheers!

 

Also check out the Simonaitis Lithuanian strain from The Yeast Bay. It produces this really interesting spicy/orange character that’s kind of hard to describe. Not really Saison like. Not really like anything else actually. You can ferment it pretty darn warm which if you want to coferment with lacto could get you acidity pretty quickly.

I haven’t had much luck getting really high attenuation with it but if you use some enzymes or maybe mix in a little Belle Saison you might be able to dry it out more.

 

I like the pear esters and cinnamon-like phenols from BE-134. I want to do something with that and El Dorado at some point this summer.

 

I like Imperial's Rustic a lot more than I like the so-called French saison yeasts I have tried (which do not include Imperial's). My saisons have generally sought yeast derived flavors. I find Rustic leans a little towards bubble gum, but not obnoxiously so. The French saison strains just don't bring the esters for me. However, that may make them better for dry hopping. I never tried to dry hop a saison.

 

It's generally not Brett that is blamed for the "biogenic amines" I mentioned in ASB, rather it's the enteric bacteria at work early in spontaneous fermentation. Lowering the pH slightly in the kettle is supposed to alleviate the issue.

 

Recently brewed a saison with Belle (fermented at 66-76F free-rise) and dry-hopped with Hallertau Blanc & Huell Melon. Came out fruity as heck and very dry. Highly recommended and very easy.

 

That said, the Blaugies strain is my overall favorite.