Sierra Nevada "not craft enough"

I stand by my comment.

 

I do drink quickly because I only buy what I'm going to drink in the next week or two.

Also your point is based on an assumption, which makes it not much of a point.

Yeah I've had far more bad beer from big names purchased at a store than when buying directly from small local breweries.

 

Not craft enough? Seriously? Offer him a local AAL next time. I'm sure he would be all over that. Then slap him for me.

 

Sure I experienced all that- I'll even take credit for some of it . I remember when you could only get broccoli rabe at Italian produce markets at a certain time of the year, or cilantro at the latin grocers, and on and on and on. Now that stuff is everywhere. But it wasn't just taste that was driving the demand for those kinds of things; it was a sense of history and exploration. Not only did we want to make the foods that our previous generations ate, we wanted to feel that bond with other cultures. Naturally, cookbooks and cooking shows played their role as well. And, of course there was a parallel with beer- going to the pork store for all sorts of German beers, or the Irish pub for pints of Guinness, etc.. But the expending taste was just a part of it; the other side of the coin was that it's a fantastic window into those respective cultures. And authenticity sure plays a big part.

There's a major difference with the way that the Brewers' Association shepherded in the "craft era", however. First of all, this was most definitely 'top down', at least as far as the rhetoric and mythology goes- a steady stream of press releases and definitions; and constant re-definitions, all in an attempt to claim and re-direct that which was happening naturally. Only one thing was missing: our legacy brewers and national brewing identity.

The implication has long been clear, has it not? This hasn't been part of a continuum; nosiree, it all started at one point in time, out of a void of nothingness. And the bad guys use corn- that's how you can tell that they're the bad guys! (Hilariously, a lot of the re-definitions stemmed from how to dance around wording their aversion to the use of adjuncts...while the chosen brewers were also using adjuncts. But in a completely different way. And not most of the time! That's the real key! )

So, yeah, the true independents who withstood that period of consolidation while maintaining their own heritage (and ours) had to be thrown under the bus (until pretty recently, as you all know. Here's the blacklist, for shits and giggles ). Consequently, we aren't using the phrase 'Independent Brewing' to this day. Although, to be honest, that ship may have sailed as well, but at least it would be meaningful to describe a brewery as "not Independent".

Getting back to the point at hand- the logical (and forseeable) result of instead choosing to use a word ("Craft") that heavily implies that great beer can't come from a large brewery (totally false!!! as we know) and pushing a narrative without any sense of history, is a Modern Craft Beer Drinker who is overly fixated on novelty and brewery size with a complete and total lack of perspective. Way to go, BA!!!

Yes, a new term was needed because certain brewers had outgrown 'Microbrewery' , but the Brewers' Association knowingly (imo) misapplied term 'Craft' because they wanted to have it both ways- a word that would imply small size while allowing its members to continue to grow. But they also had to know that there was an implicit 'quality' component as well, no?

Ultimately, I don't think it's up to Ken Grossman to decide whether he'd like to give up the term 'craft' or not. It's being taken from him by this latest generation- at least the true meaning is. That's the point(!!!). And it didn't have to happen.

 

I have friends that dismiss every beer I drink because they are 'too craft' so isn't 5 pages of bashing someone not even on BA a tad overkill? And I thought the bad trader threads were venomous.

 

Some of us are discussing the implications of his comment and the beer industry trends illuminated by it. So, it is not "5 pages of bashing someone". (Although his attitude deserves it.)

 

nah he isn't here to defend himself and this is the definition of a bully pulpit, there are no ramifications from one individual's opinion that warrant all this 'smack him' 'hit him' nonsense... I had a relevant humorous reply deleted based on the wording of one reply I had to my original comment, we all love the beer we love so just let it pass... one guy didn't want a Hoptimum one day... end of story

 

SN is bigger than most, but .......... they did it by being good, not by abusing their size & reach. Their Beer Camp projects show that they still care, & actually help the smaller , "local" guys (& women ; )) Dude is off-base. ; )
(Had a Summer Fest earlier btw. (y) )

 

Well, welcome to the somewhat ambivalent response of this site's moderators to humor!

Anyway, as I stated, not everyone here is posting personal responses to the individual (although, as I also stated, he does deserve it). But, more to the point, if all you got out of his reported comment is that "one guy didn't want a Hoptimum one day", then you're not reading the comment the same way I am (or the same way most of us here are).

 

yeah that's the real problem is how everyone is reading the comment, it's one individual's opinion, not a public figure running for office, we all hear ignorant opinions everyday and things that offend us and we don't agree with, in my mind it's best not to throw gas on a bonfire if I still need to drive to work today

 

Never had SN Pale ale, Celebration or big foot......I feel sorry for him more then anything.

 

I want to echo @hopfenunmaltz 's point about whole cone hops because it's worth repeating. With talk of "manufactured" items and hop oil (I know you aren't making a direct correlation), Sierra Nevada is actually committed to using hops that are less processed than the hops used by most other brewers.

 

I too like to support my local craft breweries. Luckily, I live in the LA / OC. So, I have plenty of options. However, I will always give due respect to the pioneers of the craft movement. Here's to you Sierra Nevada!

 

Nothing like converting Euros/Forints/Korunas in your head with a buzz. Pulling out a 1,000 HUF note for a draft kind of makes me chuckle.

They could have told me 0.05$ or 5$ and would not have cared. First was a 330ml bottle for next to nothing in Hungary-- (was about 2$ in Hungarian equivalents. Along Austrian/Czech border a 500ml mug runs a couple €.

 

Haven't logged in, In a while. But really!????

That's like being a punkrocker for life and dissing the ramones. Shame. Sierra Nevada and @sierranevadabill thanks for your great beers I can always depend on from a solid foundation.

Cheers!

 

You shouldn't support bad beer. Hopefully your locals step up their game. All things being equal I get local. Luckily for me local means better and fresher.

 

1. I don't think they were trying to imply small. They were trying to distinguish themselves from BMC, which they had rebelled against, and which had never been part of their community.
2. Despite the aforesaid mountain biker, I do not think there are many beer drinkers of any age who do not think of SN (or NB, or Stone) as craft. The only such dispute that is real, I think, is about BBC - they differ from the rest of the craft community not only in size, but in their form of ownership (publicly traded) and even their use of mass media advertising. The challenge from the other direction, those who use craft to include macro owned craft, even BMC owned craft, is greater. That usage was wrong in the past, IMO, because it ignored that craft was not just about flavorful beer, bUT about a community that produced it. Some people have a financial interest in eroding the BA distinction - some dislike it out of resentment if the BA''s rhetoric, or some list they once made that dissed some legacy regional brewers - or even out of libertarian ideology. Others of us respect the community of craft brewers represented by the BA enough to support their distinction, and will continue to do so, even as we watch to see if the community remains meaningful as the number if brewerise grows.

 

What assumption? I've been in enough breweries and talked to enough Brewers to have a pretty good idea that not all canning lines are equal.

 

I beg to differ on the implications of the word craft. The reason so many people, for so long, have associated it with 'artisanal' is because there's a direct implication there. And this biker isn't the first one with this attitude - even here on Beer Advocate there have been threads asking "is XYZ too big for craft?" for some time now.

 

And I may as well add my own reason to your list:
The use of the word Craft has had real world negative impacts on those who deserve our respect and support; impacts that exceed any marketing value gained by its continued use.