Starter wort slow to get moving (3724)

Discussion in 'Homebrewing' started by jlordi12, Apr 27, 2015.

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  1. jlordi12

    jlordi12 Pooh-Bah (1,856) Jun 8, 2011 Massachusetts
    Pooh-Bah

    My normal process for storing yeast is to make oversized starter, pour off a mason jar's worth (~300ml) and store in the fridge until I make my next starter, etc. I got a 1L starter "going" been 24+ hours without activity. The strain is 3724 and has probably been sitting in the fridge 3 months or so. Reason to be concerned or should I wait it out?
     
  2. jlordi12

    jlordi12 Pooh-Bah (1,856) Jun 8, 2011 Massachusetts
    Pooh-Bah

    Pitched @ 73, sitting at room temp.
     
  3. scurvy311

    scurvy311 Savant (1,123) Dec 3, 2005 Louisiana

    Viability may be low enough that it takes more time than you think to show signs
    It's possible, if your fridge is like mine, sometimes things freeze and thaw without noticing. (Lettuce shows this better than most things.)
    Stirplate?
     
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  4. jlordi12

    jlordi12 Pooh-Bah (1,856) Jun 8, 2011 Massachusetts
    Pooh-Bah

    Stirplate , yes. My fridge is probably on the colder side, not sure if that makes a difference in the matter.
     
  5. scurvy311

    scurvy311 Savant (1,123) Dec 3, 2005 Louisiana

    Only if the jar froze. It's hard to say if all 100% of the yeast died but it definitely will influence viability of it spent time frozen. I'd say give it another day and look for signs.
     
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  6. jlordi12

    jlordi12 Pooh-Bah (1,856) Jun 8, 2011 Massachusetts
    Pooh-Bah

    Interesting. They could have for sure, but I thought people regularly store frozen yeast.
     
  7. scurvy311

    scurvy311 Savant (1,123) Dec 3, 2005 Louisiana

    I don't have first hand experience with long term yeast storage but I think they normally store it in a solution that does not crystallize. I think freezing in water is an issue.
     
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  8. wspscott

    wspscott Pooh-Bah (1,946) May 25, 2006 Kentucky
    Pooh-Bah

    After 3 months, there is probably still live yeast, but there may not be a lot. I agree with scurvy311 to wait and see what happens.
     
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  9. jlordi12

    jlordi12 Pooh-Bah (1,856) Jun 8, 2011 Massachusetts
    Pooh-Bah

    Yea I hope to come home from work today to see something going on ...or at least smell that something had went on
     
  10. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,055) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    Freezing yeast (without special preparation) will kill some of the yeast. I once had yeast that I was pretty sure froze and thawed on its way to me. I used it anyway, because one of the yeast manufacturers said that most of the yeast would have survived. It was true... they definitely grew in the starter and then fermented the beer. But I got slight fusel alcohols (or something with a similar hot taste) in the finished beer. And it was a lager, fermented at 50F. It was probably the 6th or 7th time for that recipe, with the same process. I can't say the off-flavor was because of the freezing/thawing, with n=1 and all that. But I was quite surprised.
     
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  11. corbmoster

    corbmoster Pundit (848) Dec 15, 2014 Texas
    Trader

    I haven't worked with yeast first hand. but, when I work with bacteria in the lab and we need to have long term storage, in -80C freezer, we have to suspend them in a special solution. Otherwise, in regular water, the cells will crystallize and most would not survive the freezing / thawing.
     
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  12. PortLargo

    PortLargo Pooh-Bah (1,819) Oct 19, 2012 Florida
    Pooh-Bah

    I would say yes and yes (at least for another day).

    Three months makes it old . . . but not decrepit. My older yeasts have a longer lag time, but never 24+ hours. Unless your liquids are regularly freezing in your fridge I can't imagine your yeast are damaged this way.

    Room temp is about 80 in my house . . . I hope you're pushing at least high 70s. Are you sure about the 3 months? If older than this you may have so little yeast that there will be little activity and wouldn't be surprised if it came and went quickly (as in overnight). Did the quantity of slurry appear to increase or any aromas present (other than starter wort)? Have you tried cutting off the stir plate for an hour or two, then giving it a hard shake and seeing if it off-gases? There will be no harm in stepping it to another starter . . . maybe keep it the same size or smaller.
     
  13. HerbMeowing

    HerbMeowing Maven (1,283) Nov 10, 2010 Virginia
    Trader

    What kind of activity are you expecting?

    I've made starters where no appreciable krausen was observed ... yet
    ... its gravity indicated there be fermentation
    ... when the surface was viewed at an oblique angle ... CO2 be actively breaking the surface

    !RDWHAHB!
     
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  14. ChrisMyhre

    ChrisMyhre Initiate (0) Sep 15, 2013 Massachusetts

    I second the recommendation to take a gravity reading if you can. I had an almost 3 month old jar of 3274 start a little slow on me, but still produced one of the best saisons I've made. If potentially freezing is an issue, can you move your yeast storage to a better regulated kegerator/ keezer? I would count that as a pro tip because it also makes my wife much happier to not have yeast cluttering up our regular fridge.
     
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  15. jlordi12

    jlordi12 Pooh-Bah (1,856) Jun 8, 2011 Massachusetts
    Pooh-Bah

    The slurry may have been older than 3 months I'd have to check my recipes to see the last time I used this strain. Certainly a factor,,,

    The slurry did appear to be growing and it didn't smell like beer, thus some of my concern.

    It's all good now though, I have a mini krausen and you can tell that the slurry has tons more yeast with a naked eye
     
  16. jlordi12

    jlordi12 Pooh-Bah (1,856) Jun 8, 2011 Massachusetts
    Pooh-Bah

    I use a clear glass container on my stir plate so I can see what is going on for the most part. Normally when the starter is working the wort becomes a lot less translucent and a lot more "yeasty" for lack of a better word. Thankfully that is the case as it started ramping up sometime yesterday.
     
  17. jlordi12

    jlordi12 Pooh-Bah (1,856) Jun 8, 2011 Massachusetts
    Pooh-Bah

    Right now I just have a two tap kegerator made out of an old mini fridge. If I ever upgrade to a bigger house and more importantly a keezer I'm sure everyone would be happy. Most of the strains I hang on to are bugs and sitting room temp in my beer closet. I only had a couple in the fridge so my wife doesn't whine
     
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