Step Mashing

Discussion in 'Homebrewing' started by OldBrewer, Jan 28, 2023.

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  1. OldBrewer

    OldBrewer Maven (1,385) Jan 13, 2016 Canada (ON)

    I was wondering if anyone with step-mashing experience could help me woth this question:

    If you are only doing an alpha-amylase as well as a beta-amylase daccharification mash step, what combination of temperature and mash times, would you use to equate to a dry, fermentable wort (equivalent to a single-infusion mash of about 148-9)?; and what combination of temperature and mash times, would you use to equate to a sweeter, less fermentable wort (equivalent to a single-infusion mash of about 153-4 F)?

    I haven't found any literature that explains how these two step-mash temperatures work together.

    Thank you!
     
  2. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,375) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Society Pooh-Bah

    I have no personal experience conducting a step mash to achieve a fermentable wort. A single temperature infusion mash of 149 degrees F for 75 minutes 'does the trick' for me (e.g., brewing a Kolsch).

    Here is a link to an article discussing step mashing to achieve a fermentable wort:

    https://beerandbrewing.com/step-mash-your-way-to-a-dry-finish/

    Cheers!
     
  3. dmtaylor

    dmtaylor Savant (1,149) Dec 30, 2003 Wisconsin

    From what I can tell in my experience, total mash TIME is the real variable, and the specific temperatures don't much matter. As such...

    ANY step mash that takes any longer than about 60 minutes is going to make a very fermentable wort and a dry beer.

    If you want a sweeter, less fermentable wort, mash at whatever temperatures you want for only 30 minutes total, then runoff, sparge if desired, and immediately bring to the boil.
     
  4. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    Time is certainly a real variable. And so is temperature. Separate studies by Troester and Doss show that quanitatively for single infusion mashes. Unfortunately, there's no data (that I've ever been able to find) that quantifies the fermentability yielded by various step mash schedules. I can say from my own step mashes (with a beta rest followed by an alpha rest) that they have been slightly more fermentable than single infusion mashes of comparable total times done in the 148-151F range.
     
  5. OldBrewer

    OldBrewer Maven (1,385) Jan 13, 2016 Canada (ON)

    Thanks for the links and all the responses. The step mash regime that I used was 131 F for 15 minutes (Protein Rest), 140 F for 15 minutes (beta rest), and 149 F for 45 minutes (beta/alpha rest). I would have thought the 149 F temperature would have resulted in a relatively dry beer, but instead, it was medium (slightly sweet), even though my F.G. was 1.004. So somehow the 140 F step must have somehow contributed to the sweetness. I just wish there was some literature on how these saccharifcation combinations work together.
     
  6. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,375) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Society Pooh-Bah

    Here are some more links for your reading:

    https://www.morebeer.com/articles/Step_Mash_PartI

    https://www.morebeer.com/articles/Step_Mash_PartII

    Maybe there are some ‘answers’ there?

    The author of these articles, Jim Busch, used to participate on BA (Starkbier) but it has been over 4 years since he has visited the sight.

    Cheers!
     
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  7. OldBrewer

    OldBrewer Maven (1,385) Jan 13, 2016 Canada (ON)

  8. hopfenunmaltz

    hopfenunmaltz Pooh-Bah (2,635) Jun 8, 2005 Michigan
    Pooh-Bah

    I usually go 45 minutes at 144-145⁰F and 20 miutes at 158⁰F, followed by 10 minutes ar 170⁰F.
     
  9. OldBrewer

    OldBrewer Maven (1,385) Jan 13, 2016 Canada (ON)

    How did you come up with this arrangement? Does it end up dry, sweet, or medium? Is this for lagers or ales?
     
  10. hopfenunmaltz

    hopfenunmaltz Pooh-Bah (2,635) Jun 8, 2005 Michigan
    Pooh-Bah

    It is pretty typical for lagers. It gives a lower FG. You are at or near peak activity of beta and alpha enzymes. Alpha is shorter as the reaction happens faster at higher temperature, and the Alpha denatures fairly fast.
     
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  11. OldBrewer

    OldBrewer Maven (1,385) Jan 13, 2016 Canada (ON)

    Do you recall any literature/documentation recommending this approach?
     
  12. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    1.004 is a dry beer. Gravity doesn't lie, unless the measurement is bad. If the beer is coming across as "sweet," it must be for some reason other than residual complex sugars/dextins.

    Are you doing anything to limit oxygen exposure?
     
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  13. OldBrewer

    OldBrewer Maven (1,385) Jan 13, 2016 Canada (ON)

    I'm using a pressure fermenter, so other than the oxygen introduced during fermentation, there is no additional access to oxygen. It is still in the fermenter (just finished a diacetyl rest) so the sample was directly from the fermenter. At such a low F.G. (I use a TILT), I cannot understand why it doesn't taste more dry than it would appear to be based on the results. I assumed it might have something to do with the step mash.

    I have checked the TILT against a hydrometer, and it is within a point or two at the S.G. end, and almost consistent at the F.G. end, using a specal hydrometer focused only at the lower end.
     
  14. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    What was your batch size, OG, and hop schedule?
     
  15. OldBrewer

    OldBrewer Maven (1,385) Jan 13, 2016 Canada (ON)

    It was a 5 gallon batch, and the OG was 1.042 (lower than what I had planned for).
    Hop schedule:
    0.53 oz Magnum @14.1% Alpha for 60 minutes
    0.70 oz Tettnanger @4.1% Alpha for 15 minutes
    0.70 oz Saaz @2.8% Alpha for 15 minutes
    0.30 oz Hallertauer Mittlefruh @3.6% Alpha for 0 minutes
    0.30 oz Saaz @2.8% Alpha for 0 minutes

    The last two hop additions were added shortly after flameout for 15 minutes.
    The water profile was very low mineral (3/4 Reverse Osmosis; 1/4 tap water).
    [Resultant profile: Calc: 10; Mag: 2; Sod: 4; Sulf: 7; Chl: 7]
     
    #15 OldBrewer, Jan 30, 2023
    Last edited: Jan 30, 2023
  16. hopfenunmaltz

    hopfenunmaltz Pooh-Bah (2,635) Jun 8, 2005 Michigan
    Pooh-Bah

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  17. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    Well, that should have been plenty bitter, which shoots down where I was about to go with this, i.e. not enough bitterness to balance.

    I'm wondering if the malt(s) you used have (non-sugar) flavors that could come across as "sweet."
     
  18. OldBrewer

    OldBrewer Maven (1,385) Jan 13, 2016 Canada (ON)

    The IBU was about 30-35 IBU
    In terms of grain, I used the following:

    8.89 lb of Weyerman Floor-Malted Bohemian Pilsner
    0.20 lb of Carapils
    0.10 lb of Melanoidin Malt
     
  19. OldBrewer

    OldBrewer Maven (1,385) Jan 13, 2016 Canada (ON)

    Thank you. I've seen the BYO article before, but look forward to to reading the Braukaiser article (I might have also read that one long ago).

    BTW, does anyone know what happened to Braukaiser? He used to post some amazing articles about brewing lagers, and then suddenly, he was never heard from since.
     
  20. hopfenunmaltz

    hopfenunmaltz Pooh-Bah (2,635) Jun 8, 2005 Michigan
    Pooh-Bah

    I've heard through the interwebs that family and work were taking all of his time. He keeps his web page up, which I appreciate.

    The step mash I use is like the Hochkurz decoction as far as the rest temperatures go.
     
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