Stirred Yeast Starter Rest Before Crashing?

Discussion in 'Homebrewing' started by thebriansmaude, Nov 30, 2017.

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  1. thebriansmaude

    thebriansmaude Crusader (472) Dec 16, 2016 Canada (AB)
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    Hey BAs,

    I was reading through the yeast management section of the latest version of 'How to Brew' and noticed that Palmer mentions that if you are building a starter on a stir plate and propagating for 24 to 36 hours, you should stop the stir bar around 12 - 18 hours in and let the starter finish still for the remaining 12-18 hours in order to allow the yeast to build up glycogen and trehalose reserves in an oxygen free environment before cold crashing the starter. Those compounds help the yeast adapt to the temp crash and new wort environment of the main wort.

    Seems to make perfect sense, but this is the first I have heard of this suggestion. Does anyone else practice this method ? I am curious because I currently have a starter on its 18th or so hour and it is still visibly fermenting, ie. you can see CO2 rapidly rising to the top throughout. It really seems wrong to turn off the magnet at this point!

    Curious how other brewers feel about this step.

    Cheers!
     
  2. Ten_SeventySix_Brewhouse

    Ten_SeventySix_Brewhouse Zealot (744) Jul 20, 2016 Indiana

    I usually let my starters go for 24 hours on the stir plate, then straight into the fridge for 12-48 hours until pitch.

    This is the first I've heard of this as well, so I'd be interested to hear what people here have to say on the topic.
     
  3. thebriansmaude

    thebriansmaude Crusader (472) Dec 16, 2016 Canada (AB)
    Trader

    I should have titled this thread "Yeast starter rest before cold crash"

    Anyone know how to get that changed?

    @Ten_SeventySix_Brewhouse - That's exactly how I have been doing it too. My concern would be getting less propagation from turning off the magnet sooner.. but Palmer is suggesting only having it on for half of the duration of the period. Seems counter intuitive no?
     
  4. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    @jbakajust1
     
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  5. EvenMoreJesus

    EvenMoreJesus Initiate (0) Jun 8, 2017 Pennsylvania

    Why does this make sense?
     
  6. Bryan12345

    Bryan12345 Initiate (0) Mar 17, 2016 Texas

    Them’s a lot of words...

    I jus rip open the red packet an dump it on in...

    :slight_smile: :slight_smile: :slight_smile:
     
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  7. EvenMoreJesus

    EvenMoreJesus Initiate (0) Jun 8, 2017 Pennsylvania

    #brewmance
     
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  8. thebriansmaude

    thebriansmaude Crusader (472) Dec 16, 2016 Canada (AB)
    Trader

    Tired yeast just after propagating a starter should build up glycogen and trehalose reserves before cold crashing and then adapting to a new wort... Seems like a legit thing to want to happen to me - But I don't really know, just read that and thought, I have definitely never done that...

    Of course you can say it doesn't matter, because things have worked out fine before, but lets just say for the sake best yeast health practices , should we really be shutting off our stir plates halfway through?

    @Bryan12345 , I'm a verbose SOB
     
  9. EvenMoreJesus

    EvenMoreJesus Initiate (0) Jun 8, 2017 Pennsylvania

    Why would fermenting yeast be tired? Fermenting yeast are happy. Now, if you want to take advantage of the Pasteur Effect, you don't need to turn off your stirplate. All you need to do is put an airlock on your starter.

    Yeast naturally build up reserves of glycogen and trehalose before they flocculate, but that really isn't what you're looking for with a yeast starter, is it? You're looking for healthy, active yeast cells. The way to get them is make sure that your starter is actively fermenting when you pitch it.

    IMO, "best yeast heath practices" is to pitch actively fermenting yeast (or top cropping) and not cold crashing and decanting. Pitching dormant yeast just isn't ideal.
     
  10. thebriansmaude

    thebriansmaude Crusader (472) Dec 16, 2016 Canada (AB)
    Trader

    Interesting, it’s crazy there seems to be a lot of controversial information in the latest version of How to Brew. The bit about yeast being tired out before floculating, needing several hours to build up glycogen, how you shouldn’t pitch yeast just after high krausen, don’t put your regulator in the keezer etc. There have been quite a few tid bits that have made me say , what ?
     
  11. EvenMoreJesus

    EvenMoreJesus Initiate (0) Jun 8, 2017 Pennsylvania

    Haven't read it, but it seems like there might be.

    The yeast aren't tired, per se, they're just in a nutrient/carbon source poor environment and are finished fermenting and, therefor, have no other reason to stay active, so they build up glycogen stores before they go dormant so they can have something to metabolize when they are in a more nutrient rich environment and need to start replicating or fermenting again.

    What was the reasoning given?
     
  12. thebriansmaude

    thebriansmaude Crusader (472) Dec 16, 2016 Canada (AB)
    Trader

    “There is an approximately 18 hour Window, between peak activity and flocculation, when the east is tired and you shouldn’t pitch it”

    That’s all he says about that..
     
  13. EvenMoreJesus

    EvenMoreJesus Initiate (0) Jun 8, 2017 Pennsylvania

    Love to see a citation on that, because it doesn't jive with actual science.
     
  14. Brewday

    Brewday Zealot (721) Dec 25, 2015 New York

    I was surprised to read the part that says homebrewers should use aquarium pumps and not pure oxygen because we can over oxygenate.
     
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  15. thebriansmaude

    thebriansmaude Crusader (472) Dec 16, 2016 Canada (AB)
    Trader

    @Brewday I know ! The one that surprised me the most was keep your tank and regulator out of your keezer, as condensation ruins them ...
     
  16. EvenMoreJesus

    EvenMoreJesus Initiate (0) Jun 8, 2017 Pennsylvania

    Bah! As long as you only oxygenate before pitching, it doesn't matter. Your yeast will use all the oxygen in solution before they start fermenting your wort.
     
    #16 EvenMoreJesus, Dec 4, 2017
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2017
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