Stout Recipe Critique

Discussion in 'Homebrewing' started by invertalon, Sep 8, 2015.

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  1. invertalon

    invertalon Pooh-Bah (2,249) Jan 27, 2009 Ohio
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Hello everyone,

    I am currently planning out my next brew... Something to brew in a week in a half when my lager finishes up in the fermentation freezer.

    I am thinking of doing an American stout... Something in the 8-9% ABV range. I am a big fan of the roasted coffee and chocolate flavors from the specialty malts, I don’t plan to infuse with anything at this point. I am not after a hoppy stout, just intense roasted flavors without being overly sweet or harsh. Once this beer has two weeks in primary I plan to rack to secondary and let sit for at least a month before bottling/priming. Giving it time to mellow a bit…

    I am planning to adjust my water for the first time on this one... Still researching references to come up with target profiles… Also, do you just treat your entire mash/sparge water volume to the target or just the mash water? I asked on a different topic but got no reply… First time doing this so want to be sure.


    Anyway, here is the recipe I have planned so far (percentage of malt bill):


    Rahr 2-row (65.8%)
    Munich Malt (12.2%)
    Chocolate Malt (7.9%)
    Roasted Barley (5.3%)
    Black Patent (2.6%)
    Crystal 60L (2.6%)
    Victory Malt (2.6%)

    Hops:
    Magnum (boil for 60min, 48 IBU)
    Willamette (boil for 30min, 12 IBU)

    Yeast:
    Dry English Ale WLP007 (with 1.5L Starter, crashed and decanted prior to pitch).

    Targets:
    1.084 SG, 1.020 FG, 60 IBU, 55 SRM, 8.4% ABV

    Going to mash for 60mins at 153F, batch sparge at 170F. Going to ferment at 65F for the primary period… It will then be at 68F or so for secondary conditioning for the next month following.

    Any comments/suggestions on the recipe?
     
    #1 invertalon, Sep 8, 2015
  2. atomeyes

    atomeyes Initiate (0) Jul 13, 2011 Canada (ON)

    i am for roast barley at 7%. also, you don't have much unfermentables in there. so that and your mashing temps and it will be a relatively dry stout.
    otherwise, sure. why not.
    oh yeah, your ferment temps. let it finish in primary a bit warmer than that or you'll have some residual sugars in there. 65 F is a great pitching temp and good for the first 48 hrs of fermenting. after that, let it go up on its own (slowly) until its above 70 F
     
    #2 atomeyes, Sep 8, 2015
  3. Supergenious

    Supergenious Maven (1,273) May 9, 2011 Michigan

    That should make a good beer. I prefer Maris otter in my stouts, also some flaked oats are nice. You've got around 15% dark/ roasted malts, which is what I like to shoot for.
    As far as water: just shoot for at least 50 Ca, and a Cl:SO4 of about 2:1. Add whatever salts to your mash, needed to get your ph around 5.5 (I use Brewcipher for building water profile). Then you can add more to your kettle to balance out Cl:SO4 ratio.
     
    #3 Supergenious, Sep 8, 2015
    GormBrewhouse likes this.
  4. aobrehm

    aobrehm Initiate (0) Jun 18, 2015 Oregon

    Stylistically, you might be missing the mark if you want this to be an American stout. That doesn't mean it won't be a great beer, but it might be worth revisiting the BJCP style guidelines:

    OG: 1.050-1.075
    IBU: 35-75
    ABV: 5-7%

    These are guidelines, so you don't need to adhere strictly to them. I'm sure everyone has had an American Stout that wasn't quite imperial but still exceeded that 7% upper limit. What these guidelines do suggest is a bitterness ratio (IBU divided by OG points) of about .8 to 1. The recipe you have put together has a bitterness ratio of .7.

    With this in mind, I might consider adding just a small amount of hops closer to the end of the boil to boost your bitterness just slightly and balance out the malt. You said you aren't looking for a hoppy stout, but at a bitterness ratio of .8 you still will perceive this as a malt-forward beer. I love Centennial and Northern Brewer in my stouts, but just about any American hop will do.
     
    #4 aobrehm, Sep 8, 2015
  5. invertalon

    invertalon Pooh-Bah (2,249) Jan 27, 2009 Ohio
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Yeah, I originally followed the BJCP guideline but eventually ended up out of the American Stout category up to the Imperial Stout area, which is fine, but I will likely plan to keep it more on the low side of the ABV area. Would I be OK to keep the SRM around 55 or is there a downfall to being beyond the 40 or so for the style? 40 is considered 'black' so would 40 vs 55 even matter?
     
    #5 invertalon, Sep 8, 2015
  6. aobrehm

    aobrehm Initiate (0) Jun 18, 2015 Oregon

    My understanding of SRM is that once you get above 40, it's essentially black. I'm not sure the human eye could even detect the difference between 40 and 55, so I wouldn't make that a priority.
     
    #6 aobrehm, Sep 8, 2015
    invertalon likes this.
  7. invertalon

    invertalon Pooh-Bah (2,249) Jan 27, 2009 Ohio
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Great, thanks!
     
    #7 invertalon, Sep 8, 2015
  8. wspscott

    wspscott Pooh-Bah (1,958) May 25, 2006 Kentucky
    Pooh-Bah

    I think that looks like a reasonable stout, but why the Victory malt? What are you hoping that gives you since you already have Munich? BTW, how dark of Munich are you thinking? A 6L Munich is different from a 20L American Munich malt. Also, you might try a couple different Chocolate malts, there is a wide range of "colors".
     
    #8 wspscott, Sep 9, 2015
  9. invertalon

    invertalon Pooh-Bah (2,249) Jan 27, 2009 Ohio
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    I thought about using the Victory to give it that bready/cracker note. I used that malt heavily on an APA a few brews ago (11% of the bill) and really loved the flavor. More so experimentation wise, I figure why not use some in a stout? About the only reason.

    As far as the Munich goes, it's whatever the LHBS has available. Not sure on the specifics, it may be 10L if their website is accurate. Not sure at the moment with the chocolate malt, either. Most of the malt they have is Breiss if that helps any.
     
    #9 invertalon, Sep 9, 2015
  10. invertalon

    invertalon Pooh-Bah (2,249) Jan 27, 2009 Ohio
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    For the water people out there... I used Bru'n Water to come up with my additions to the mash and sparge to hit my target profile and pH... I did input all my grain additions and acidity into the proper tab for an estimated beer color of 53 SRM.

    For the mash (5.8gal):
    0.3g Epsom Salt, 0.6g Salt, 0.3g Calcium Chloride, 1.2g Pickling Lime

    Sparge (3.7gal):
    0.2g Epsom Salt, 0.4g Salt, 0.2g Calcium Chloride.


    This will get me an estimated...
    65ppm Calcium
    10ppm Magnesium
    19ppm Sodium
    35ppm Sulfate
    40ppm Chloride
    203ppm Bicarbonate
    Mash pH of 5.5

    Now on the water adjustment page for Bru'n Water, there is a box to check off "Add CaSO4 & CaCl to replace Chalk & Lime in Sparge Water?". Is this something I want to do? My raw water calcium is 33ppm. The directions were a bit vague...


    Appreciate the help/input!
     
    #10 invertalon, Sep 9, 2015
  11. BeboThoughts

    BeboThoughts Zealot (559) Mar 24, 2012 Canada (ON)
    Trader

    Just my opinion but if you're using the epsom salt just for magnesium, I'd leave it out. I'd also leave out the salt (assuming table salt) - a little goes a long way to making a salty beer.

    I like stouts at 100 chloride and 50 sulfate but that's personal taste. I like big bodied and malty stouts.
     
    #11 BeboThoughts, Sep 9, 2015
  12. invertalon

    invertalon Pooh-Bah (2,249) Jan 27, 2009 Ohio
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Well Epsom also being used to bring Sulfate up a bit more than Magnesium. The salt is being used for both Sodium and Chloride (10.4 and 16ppm respectively).

    My "raw" water is at 10ppm sodium, the salt addition is to bump it up to 20ppm.


    I will also be used a campden tablet (about half a tablet for all 10 gallons or so of water being used) to treat for chlorine. Does that add anything into the water profile I have not adjusted for?
     
    #12 invertalon, Sep 9, 2015
  13. wspscott

    wspscott Pooh-Bah (1,958) May 25, 2006 Kentucky
    Pooh-Bah

    I don't think the Victory would hurt, but I don't think you will notice it in this beer. I have also used some Victory with 2 row in APA/IPA to "mimic" Marris Otter but that was a much more basic grain bill. All of that is to say, I would not bother buying Victory especially for this stout, but if you have some laying around, feel free to use it :slight_smile:
     
    #13 wspscott, Sep 10, 2015
  14. invertalon

    invertalon Pooh-Bah (2,249) Jan 27, 2009 Ohio
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    So I picked up my ingredients yesterday for this beer... Going to brew it this Saturday.

    Some changes though... Ended up going with a specialty roasted barley to try called Patagonia Perla Negra (Black Pearl).

    Also instead of WLP007 because they were out I am going with Nottingham per recommendation from the LHBS as a good sub. I am just going to rehydrate and pitch 2 packets... I think I may keep a tiny bit of the second packet for bottling to ensure enough yeasties (maybe 1/4 of the second packet or so).

    Looking forward to seeing how it comes out!
     
    #14 invertalon, Sep 14, 2015
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2015
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