Tactfully complaining to your trade partner?

Discussion in 'Trade Talk' started by PSU_Mike, Aug 30, 2015.

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  1. PSU_Mike

    PSU_Mike Initiate (0) Sep 6, 2013 Pennsylvania

    Here is the scenario. I did this trade via facebook so I'll throw out full details.

    I put up an FT:ISO for one of my Mango Sourers for Tree House beers. I was non-descript in my request but was willing to work with anyone who responded. I got a private message offering a very reasonable response offering Julius, Haze, Alter Ego, and Green. I asked to go $4$ as these were limited beers all around and it's reasonable to do so in this instance. He agreed and sent me the prices of all of them as he bought them at the brewery (he's reasonably local). I requested 2 of each and stated I would add a BA Brick Kiln from Jackie O's to even off the cost (it was actually me spending slightly more but I didn't really care).

    He admitted he was a fairly novice trader. I was at one point too, and still kind of am. I only have ~20 trades under my belt so I really don't care. Everyone has to start somewhere and should be given reasonable opportunity to do so. Anyway...

    I threw in 4 solid extras including 2 other Jackie O's, a Voodoo stout, and a Dune Fruit from Carton. He threw in 2 really solid extras from Tree House that weren't apart of the 4 originally discussed. What's to complain about right?

    Well, I really think the beers weren't treated properly from brewery to me. I've had 3 of the 4 IPAs agreed upon and thought they were far inferior to my expectations based on reviews. There are 13 day old IPAs with 0 hop presence. I've experienced IPAs that were in the heat before and I suspect this is the case.

    On paper, I am very satisfied with the trade. He sent me what was agreed upon with 2 really solid extras that I am thrilled with. I sent him what was agreed upon with 4 extras that he commented back to me something to the effect of "novice traders should be required to trade with you to show them how it's done." I'm not that good...but I digress. He followed that up with "if you ever want anything from Tree House, let me know" and has since repeated it.

    So here's the thing. I legitimately think this guy is a solid dude who didn't know any better. I want to think this was an innocent mistake (assuming that these were beers that weren't properly handled and not a product of the hype machine which is also entirely possible).

    So given all this information, how do I tactfully bring this up to my trade partner to not thoroughly piss him and still maintaining our relationship while resolving the issue?
     
  2. GatorLCA

    GatorLCA Initiate (0) Dec 29, 2012 Florida

    I'd delete this post cause, I'd be annoyed if someone was complaining about me on an open forum without brining it to me first.

    It's like any other relationship, some work, some don't when you ask the hard questions
     
    johnyb, youbrewidrink, KSOZE and 4 others like this.
  3. BEERschlitz

    BEERschlitz Initiate (0) Oct 13, 2013 Michigan

    Sounds like a perfect trade, other than you complaining about the beers not living up to your no doubt monstrous expectations. If everyone contacted a trade partner every time that happened, no one would trade anymore.
     
  4. pagriley

    pagriley Pooh-Bah (2,382) Oct 27, 2014 Illinois
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Or, it might be entirely you... Not trying to be a dick, but your palate might be off, you might be a bit sick, or the beers just aren't the mana from heaven that you were expecting. I personally wasn't blown away by Julius, and gave it a very similar rating to you, so I would put it down to hype...

    Just for the hell of it, I looked up the weather in Monson, MA and Boston - the hottest it got in the past 10 days was low to mid 80's, but most of the time it was high 70's as a max, and below 60 overnight.

    The beers in question are all in cans, so no risk of light damage, and even if this guy literally left it sitting in the trunk of his car all week (and what beer guy does that?!), it was perhaps 10-15 degrees warmer than room temperature for a few hours a couple of times for the entire week.

    A few extra degrees of storage temp isn't going to make a 10 day old IPA suck - he would have had to store them all week in the oven to do that...
     
  5. Brewski

    Brewski Initiate (0) Jul 22, 2012 Pennsylvania

    Since you're asking for people's opinion there is no issue. You asked for IPAs in a trade and received very fresh ones. Then you rated them fairly high for beers that you believe were affected by the heat. I would think that you were expecting something mind blowing and the beers didn't live up to your expectations. So I would suggest not to contact him.
     
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  6. whiskey

    whiskey Maven (1,308) Feb 25, 2012 California
    Trader

    All this ^
    Way too speculative on your part. Also, I've had HT travel coast to coast during a heat wave and it was still hoppy and killer.
     
    JavaNoire likes this.
  7. BearsOnAcid

    BearsOnAcid Pooh-Bah (2,239) Mar 17, 2009 Massachusetts
    Pooh-Bah

    When you say "0 hop presence" what do you mean?

    I can take any IPA and put it in the microwave and it will still be hoppy. Maybe you just expected them to be way better/different than they actually are?
     
  8. TampaRainman

    TampaRainman Savant (1,084) Feb 17, 2014 Florida
    Trader

    Wait a second. As the more experienced trader schooling the lad, didn't you make sure he gave you the standard "100% satisfaction or your trade back!!!" guarantee? I mean shit, standard forms for that are available--there's no reason to use them.

    Seriously though, let's turn the tables for argument's sake. What would you do if he--after he tastes the mango sourer that you sent him--writes to you moaning about how it was too sour, or not mango-ey enough? What if the only explanation he can think of for why that beer didn't rock his world is that you must have mishandled it? Will you go fetch him a new one and tell him how sorry you are?

    C'mon man. I don't recall if TH date-stamps its cans--but if it does, and if they were fresh, then to me you have 2 options: (i) tell your partner that you weren't blown away by them, but would love to try them again to see if maybe it was just an off batch (and you'll be happy to work out another fair trade when the time comes and he can snag them); or (ii) not worry about the fact that you didn't fall in love with these couple beers, not "tactfully" accuse this guy of mishandling the beers, and just try other TH beers down the road (or not) via another trade with him (or someone else). Seeing as how he seemed so enamored with your trading style and how he offered to be your TH hookup, I'd go with the option 2. I mean, if he keeps sending you IPAs that he's purposely par-boiled, he should probably realize that's not going be a recipe for longevity.

    If TH doesn't date-stamp its beers and there's some concern he's sending you old-ass IPAs, then pursue option 1 or 2 above or just move along.

    Nobody likes the person who eats their whole meal at a restaurant and then bitches to the waiter about how it wasn't their favorite meal with the expectation of getting it taken off the bill or getting a free dessert. Don't be that person.
     
  9. ResIpsaLoquitur

    ResIpsaLoquitur Initiate (0) Feb 28, 2010 New York
    Trader

    its
    date stamping some, and not date stamping others. Theyre in the process of testing out the system. I know this for a fact because when I was there last week I noticed that the Julius cans had no date stamp, but the alter ego cans and green cans did. I asked and was told theyre still in the testig process.
     
  10. ResIpsaLoquitur

    ResIpsaLoquitur Initiate (0) Feb 28, 2010 New York
    Trader

    Not for nothing, but you do realize that once you posted this thread the whole "tactfulness" part of your inquiry was lost?
     
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  11. HugeBulge

    HugeBulge Savant (1,132) Dec 31, 2012 New York

    Maybe the heat from shipping? You should be messaging him directly. Nobody can help here.
     
  12. mythaeus

    mythaeus Pooh-Bah (2,074) Jul 22, 2013 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Hey man, had the beers you sent. They were good, but not amazing as I expected or heard. Some of the cans seem to have very little hops in them. Have you had previous batches of these, if so, how do they compare? Incidentally, do you usually keep your beers in the fridge or cool dry area of the house?

    A trade relationship is like any relationship. The key is communication and always honesty and civil approach to concerns. Make no assumptions of how anything was handled, simply ask questions without accusing. A good trade partner wouldn't mind questions and a new trader could use some guidance if necessary.
     
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  13. evilcatfish

    evilcatfish Pooh-Bah (2,116) May 11, 2012 Missouri
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    If you really think the issues are caused by the heat then don't trade/ship beer in the summer anymore. Problem solved.
     
    JavaNoire likes this.
  14. JStampler

    JStampler Initiate (0) Jan 15, 2013 Pennsylvania

    Tree House beers aren't very hoppy. If you were expecting a hop bomb, you traded for the wrong beers. I should look way back to my first trade and ask for my stuff back, those FFF beers were way too malty.
     
    blassor likes this.
  15. phishphorce

    phishphorce Savant (1,023) Aug 4, 2011 Pennsylvania
    Trader

    I recently got a growler of Green from TH and I was wayyy underwhelmed. Way Bitter and not nearly the beer i was expecting based on reviews. Not my Trading partners fault though. I'll know in the future to not trade for that beer again.

    Sometimes expectations exceed reality. Again not the trading partners fault.
     
  16. beernuts

    beernuts Initiate (0) Jan 23, 2014 Virginia

    He said "If you ever want anything from Tree House, let me know".

    I'd reply, "thanks for the offer, I think I'll take you up on it when the weather cools off a bit. Those beers were not as hoppy as I was expecting, and I'm guessing it probably had to do with getting hot during transit, since they were obviously fresh. I'm looking forward to trading with you again though!"

    That way you get your message across (heat damages hoppy beer, its very important to keep them as cool as possible) without directing it squarely at him.
     
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  17. Christoph21

    Christoph21 Initiate (0) Jul 13, 2015 Florida

    I've had a lot of IPAs. Personally I think Julius is way overhyped. Green is ok. Haze is fantastic. Here's the rub I know what type of hops I like, maybe the blend in Haze has more varietals of the hops I prefer. I wouldn't say the julius I had wasn't "hoppy" it just wasn't my preferred definition of "hoppy". I have a feeling this may be what you are experiencing.
     
    KSOZE likes this.
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