The Forgotten Mr. Gladstone

Discussion in 'Beer Talk' started by minderbender, Feb 6, 2015.

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  1. herrburgess

    herrburgess Grand Pooh-Bah (3,077) Nov 4, 2009 South Carolina
    Pooh-Bah

    Sure. And those rulers could also use the previous purity laws from places like Bamberg, Nuremberg, Augsburg, etc. as a means to justify their desire to control bread prices. But that doesn't do much to explain the provenance of such laws taken as a whole -- which is why primary source material is essential here.
     
    #41 herrburgess, Feb 6, 2015
  2. drtth

    drtth Initiate (0) Nov 25, 2007 Pennsylvania
    In Memoriam

    Exactly, which is why its best to direct your question about primary source material to one of the authors of the claim.

    Edit: As for me, I'm quite comfortable taking the claim on board given a variety of non-primary source material evidence which all points to the correctness of the analysis. There is very little likelihood I'll ever have learned enough German to be able to do an intelligent reading of any existing documents in German from that era.... :slight_smile:
     
    #42 drtth, Feb 6, 2015
  3. herrburgess

    herrburgess Grand Pooh-Bah (3,077) Nov 4, 2009 South Carolina
    Pooh-Bah

    @patto1ro

    (Done.)
     
    #43 herrburgess, Feb 6, 2015
  4. minderbender

    minderbender Initiate (0) Jan 18, 2009 New York

    I'm quite happy with the way the discussion has gone, but I just want to remind everyone that the real point here is to get Sam Calagione to go on record about Mr. Gladstone's Free Mash Tun Act of 1880. If he has the balls!
     
    #44 minderbender, Feb 6, 2015
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  5. herrburgess

    herrburgess Grand Pooh-Bah (3,077) Nov 4, 2009 South Carolina
    Pooh-Bah

    I'd like to see Sam Calagione brew a decent RHG-compliant Munich Helles -- and write a sonnet. If he has the skillz!
     
    #45 herrburgess, Feb 6, 2015
  6. minderbender

    minderbender Initiate (0) Jan 18, 2009 New York

    Yeah, what the hell, here I think is the sentiment you are embracing. "The Sonnet" by William Wordsworth:

    NUNS fret not at their convent's narrow room,
    And hermits are contented with their cells,
    And students with their pensive citadels;
    Maids at the wheel, the weaver at his loom,
    Sit blithe and happy; bees that soar for bloom,
    High as the highest peak of Furness fells,
    Will murmur by the hour in foxglove bells:
    In truth the prison unto which we doom
    Ourselves no prison is: and hence for me,
    In sundry moods, 'twas pastime to be bound
    Within the Sonnet's scanty plot of ground;
    Pleased if some souls (for such there needs must be)
    Who have felt the weight of too much liberty,
    Should find brief solace there, as I have found.
    ​
    [Update: And here is an interesting blog post on the aesthetic consequences of New York's Zoning Law of 1916 (a kind of architectural Reinheitsgebot, you might say).]
     
    #46 minderbender, Feb 6, 2015
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  7. herrburgess

    herrburgess Grand Pooh-Bah (3,077) Nov 4, 2009 South Carolina
    Pooh-Bah

    And here's a excerpt of that "innovative," unfettered icon of modern American poetry, Allen Ginsberg:

    "...who bit detectives in the neck and shrieked with delight
    in policecars for committing no crime but their
    own wild cooking pederasty and intoxication,
    who howled on their knees in the subway and were
    dragged off the roof waving genitals and manuscripts…"

    Not to mention that the oddly prescriptive BA definitions of "craft" and (now) "quality" that Calagione and his ilk have put together are quite constraining in their own right. Just silly....
     
    #47 herrburgess, Feb 6, 2015
  8. minderbender

    minderbender Initiate (0) Jan 18, 2009 New York

    Incidentally I believe it was Gladstone who convinced Alfred Lord Tennyson to accept knighthood.
     
    #48 minderbender, Feb 7, 2015
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  9. F2brewers

    F2brewers Maven (1,432) Mar 12, 2005 Massachusetts
    Society Trader

    Thread is now locked.

    It's clear @mindbender is a troll woth some kind of personal animosity towards Sam.

    Let it go.
     
    #49 F2brewers, Feb 7, 2015
    1eyed_jack and breadwinner like this.
  10. patto1ro

    patto1ro Pooh-Bah (2,084) Apr 26, 2004 Netherlands
    Pooh-Bah

    Can't believe that I forgot to mention that Gladstone was first elected as MP for my home town, Newark-on-Trent. There's a plaque on the former coaching inn the Turks Head on the market place saying he gave his victory speech there.

    "partly through the influence of the local patron, the Duke of Newcastle", Wikipedia says.

    Gladstone was elected MP for Newark in 1832. This is what happened in the 1830 election:

    http://barclayperkins.blogspot.nl/2014/01/important-sale-of-licensed-property.html

    For those who can't be arsed to follow the link: the Duke of Newcastle owned much of the freehold in Newark and many of the voters were his tenants. The ballot wasn't secret. He evicted all of his tenants who voted against his candidate.

    A little bit more than "the influence of the local patron" was involved in Gladstone's election. Who would have dared vote against the Duke's man?

    It's made me think differently about Gladstone.
     
    #50 patto1ro, Feb 7, 2015
  11. Stignacious

    Stignacious Pooh-Bah (1,878) Aug 24, 2011 New York
    Pooh-Bah

    I wasn't aware that there was a Victorian-era British Politics forum...suffice it to say I never cared that much for the guy. A prostitute is a prostitute, no matter how nice you are
     
    #51 Stignacious, Feb 7, 2015
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