Up the Min for Top Beers by State

Talk Discussion in 'BeerAdvocate Talk' started by drtth, Oct 28, 2014.

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  1. drtth

    drtth Initiate (0) Nov 25, 2007 Pennsylvania
    In Memoriam

    I'd like to suggest that the m value used in calculating Top Beers within each state be bumped up from 10 to 100 or something close to that value.

    A value of 10 basically leaves the top 50 by state looking like more like the Top New Beers List than like the Top 250 beers. This small m of 10 puts an undue emphasis on very local offerings from a very few popular breweries and does not really represent the beers of a state (at least in the case of PA).

    For example, in PA, those of us who are reasonably local to a popular brewery such as Tired Hands (which does not bottle or distribute their beers) don't need to be told they are popular and their beers are only easily acquired by visiting the brewpub. (Which can be problemmatical for non residents unless they are willing to travel.) Similarly I already know that Bullfrog is doing some popular beers over in western PA but that is about 400 miles away from where I sit and not a casual journey and again someplace doing beers that are hard to sample without lots of hassle.

    Thus the current m for calculating Top beers doesn't enable the list to provide much information to the casual or serious beer consumer that isn't also easily obtained by looking through the forum for that state. Nor does it offer much benefit to many travelers who want to pick up some of the Top beers in a state to carry back to their home state. Very few want to go to a difficult location to find and fill up a lot of growlers. Many more want to go to a shop and buy bottles or a case of beer to carry home.
     
  2. Todd

    Todd Founder (13,518) Aug 23, 1996 Finland
    STAFF Mod Team Society Pooh-Bah

    It probably wouldn't work so well; right now. Many of the lists would fail.

    Note: m defaults to 10 for beer styles, US regions, and countries too. And no one seems to have a problem with it.

    http://www.beeradvocate.com/lists/us/
     
  3. treznor

    treznor Pooh-Bah (1,814) Dec 20, 2006 North Carolina
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    I know it might be incredibly difficult to figure out, but it might be worth changing m so that its defined on a sliding scale based on the overall number of ratings in the state. E.g. PA has 5 times the checkins as South Dakota so needs an m of 50 to get on the list versus the 10 in SD. Or maybe 30 so its not completely linear. The data analysis nerd in me says that makes more sense, the computer programmer nerd in me says that's a lot more difficult to do...
     
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  4. Todd

    Todd Founder (13,518) Aug 23, 1996 Finland
    STAFF Mod Team Society Pooh-Bah

    This would actually be extremely easy to do now; thanks to a recent update. All it would take is a few adjustments to a database table or two, some minor code changes, and adding it to our daily beer stats cron.

    And we could apply it other datasets/lists too.

    I'll take a look at it later tonight or tomorrow. My brain needs food and beer right now...
     
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  5. Todd

    Todd Founder (13,518) Aug 23, 1996 Finland
    STAFF Mod Team Society Pooh-Bah

    Testing now. Really digging the results so far. It changes everything.

    The only issue, and it's not really an issue per se, is that list for smaller/less active states that host a large national/regional brewery will be dominated by them; like Delaware and Dogfish Head. But it is what it is, the examples are very few, and it'll no doubt change with time as more breweries open and people rate their beers.

    More to follow ...
     
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  6. drtth

    drtth Initiate (0) Nov 25, 2007 Pennsylvania
    In Memoriam

    Good idea!
     
  7. drtth

    drtth Initiate (0) Nov 25, 2007 Pennsylvania
    In Memoriam

    Sounds like it might be working out. And that bit about DFH and DE seems from here a bit more reasonable outcome, so long as new places stand a chance of getting on the list, than having the PA list dominated by places like Tired Hands which is good beer but is mostly brewpub only operation and not easily found outside one part of the Philly burbs.

    Let me know if you want a bit of user testing for the mid Atlantic states region.
     
    jmdrpi likes this.
  8. kscaldef

    kscaldef Initiate (0) Jun 11, 2010 Oregon

    Looks like this got applied to more than just states? The Top 250 list now says "m = minimum ratings required to be considered (currently 57) " which seems a little odd (and reshuffled a _lot_ of the list). Beers of Fame is now "m = minimum ratings required to be considered (currently 278)". Going the other direction, the Top New Beers increased from 10 to "m = minimum ratings required to be considered (currently 24)".
     
  9. Todd

    Todd Founder (13,518) Aug 23, 1996 Finland
    STAFF Mod Team Society Pooh-Bah

    Duff27 and drtth like this.
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