Warnings on threadshitting

Trade beers. Don't talk shit. Don't over analyze it. Shut down comments on the ISO:FT forum. My god, it's just beer. If you actually spent time enjoying drinking it than planning your next trade, one quarter of this problem would even exist.

 

Disagree, it does cause harm. Part of the reason beer trading has become like the stock market is due to traders treating beer as a commodity rather than a drink to be enjoyed and shared. This may sound old school but I think it's a problem that has become more and more prevalent due to several reasons but one of those reasons is created by others comments.

How many times does someone think twice about a trade or start asking for more because some jabroni commented "you're being way too generous, you could get twice as much" or perhaps someone is about to do a trade and someone else comments "this will never happen, I just got this this and that". It's bullshit and I know it's hard to believe but there are people out there, wait for it...that comment (and in some cases lie) in others ISO's just to hype up their own beer and drive up trade value.

If left unchecked, the heckling usually evolves into a pissing contest between two groups of people, who have nothing to do with the trade, arguing back and forth why the trade is off and why xyz beer is more valuable than the other.

Again, if someone is that concerned in helping others than send them a pm telling them what you think. Why don't most people do this? Probably because they're not trying to be as helpful as they claim and without serving their own agenda in front of the trading audience then it's not worth it to them to take the extra minute by trying to help privately.

Yeah, yeah, yeah...some comments are helpful because people "didn't know whatever about the beer" but most of that info can be found in other threads using the search feature or google. There's also the argument that comments prevent new traders from being taken advantage of. Again, a pm could take care of that.

Overall comments can definitely be fun, informative and entertaining but it usually turns into a shit show of nothing more then people thumping their chest over which beer should trade higher, tastes better, blah blah blah. Personally I'm sick of people using comments to help themselves under the guise of helping others.

Same rant as always, I'm sure everyone will see it again for the 100th time in another 6 months when we revisit this topic

 

This sums it up. For the most part, peeps that are in favor of comments fall into the categories above. They surely won't admit it, but they do, in some way shape or form. The *hidden agenda*. Either way, one would have to have their * blinders* on if they think that in today's current system, that comments are more helpful than hindrance.

 

Well, I considered the trade as I remember how tough it was to get Coffee Abraxas awhile back. I did some research and saw someone mention the dating on the bottle and I would be disappointed if I got that bottle.
Not being a Homer saying it doesn't stack up, I was pointing out that it was beyond its best by date.

 

Everyone please send all your beyond 60 day old Cofee Abraxas to me, I'll be disappointed but I'll take one for BA. In all seriousness your comment was snarky and if it was phrased differently might still be present.

 

Dude, get over the "cali trader" shit. Your logic sucks.
Why do you think I was considering the trade? Because it looked good! Because I felt Coffee Abraxas traded way higher than FO!
Did I say "you need to add" or "ratios?".... nope.
I read that there was a"drink within" time and I asked because I would have been disappointed if I received it and it was 6 months passed that date and the trader did not tell me.

Also, "your coffee Abraxas". So now your comments should be deemed worthless because you have a vested interest?
Killin me!!!!!!

"Is it true there is a drink within time?" is snarky?
You need tougher skin.

 

If I had Maine dinner and was offering it for Sculpin, but the Dinner was 6 months old, would it be OK for me to omit that info in my ISO?
Would you be upset when you got your 6 month old Dinner?

 

How about you just PM the OP instead of trying to "warn others". If you were really concerned you would just PM him directly. If you don't do your research then it's your fault if you didn't know there was a "drink by" date.

 

You wouldn't want that heads up?

Your perspective makes me suspect of your character.

 

@whiskey Obviously, you need to do your due diligence if you are going to make a high profile trade. I mean, how can you really address every single concern that exists with every single beer produced? You just cant. I'm sure you could search for "Coffee Abraxas" and probably find the info you're looking for. I think the issue here is people are taking it upon themselves to try and devalue others beers when they had no such intention of even trying to acquire it. Are you going to go into every single Pliny, or IPA thread and tell them the hops have dropped off after 30 days? Or that coffee tends to drop off very quickly? You just can't do it, and you have to do your own research. As a consumer who has access to internet, there is no excuse in my opinion. People buy crappy stuff all the time and regret it because they didn't do research beforehand. People need to take accountability. If you are concerned about a particular beer, why not come into this help Forum and ask for help? Everyone is just trying to justify being able to interject their commentary into others threads, and it just gets out of hand and difficult to control. It's like going into someone's thread ISO Assassin and telling them "the bourbon is too strong on the nose, be careful!"... helpful? Not really, but of course on BA threadshitters will justify anything.

 

The Assassin comparison is poor.
I did research and found nothing conclusive, including a Google search for a closeup of the label. Give it a try.
So I asked.... and if it should be common knowledge or I should do my research, why was he reluctant to answer publicly?



@amsguitarist why was he reluctant?

 

@whiskey You have a lot more tools at your disposal. You can look up recent reviews of Coffee Abraxas. Look for "taste has fallen off a cliff". You can also look at the traders feedback and search for "ripped me off", "wasn't honest about the bottle being sent", "sent expired bottles". Last but not least, if you conducted the trade with him, received an "expired bottle", request that he replace it, or make up for it in some way... if not, leave him bad feedback so the next person can see what the person is doing.

 

And honestly, from what I see on here, most BA's are not out to screw you over. Most would rectify the situation. I would take less trade manipulation over so called "informative threadshits" any day.

 

I want to thank the moderators for engaging in this topic so thoroughly. I've been using this website conditionally for almost a year now and it's really incredible. By this time, next year, you'll be twice as big as you were. You're all doing a great job, BeerAdvocate literally works wonders for everyone who has used the site because of uncertainty before or after a purchase or for a trade-related basis due to lack of distribution. I have made quite a few friends because of this place, that's something invaluable. The website is half open-source, we upload the bottle pictures, we upload the places we've been, we review the beer, we all discuss more beer releases and places, the breweries even chime in on events and what not. Along with trade ratings, which are graded honestly. The moderators host the site and look for large groups of people getting annoyed by unnecessary dialogue, which is circulated by a Report button and revolving threads, like this one. I don't believe this topic is going to be needing a visit or haunting us any longer, it sounds like a cure is coming.

 

Interesting thoughts, thanks for being so candid. Imagine what we could accomplish if only we had more uses like you who clearly see some of the challenges we face as a community. Imagine if we didn't have troll accounts of people trying to sabotage others due to personal vendettas. Imagine if everyone who commented in others ISO's were as honest as your reply above and the ratings you reference. Imagine if there were no moderation at all, oh my! No one would ever complain and we could have our own little utopia. We would be so rebellious! We could even call ourselves "outcasts", use similar language to be "cool" and tell everyone how great we are. Maybe we could even create our own 1%'er stickers to let everyone know we're not like everyone else.

Apologies for getting a little distracted, surely we could never be that perfect. A "commmunity" like that is pure fantasy. I can only dream of being part of something so ideal but I fear I would never be cool enough. I could never be that hard core and that anti establishment.

Anyways, I'm glad you made some friends while you were here. Based on your reply I'm not surprised, you seem like the open minded and HONEST type of person we all strive to be. I don't recognize your name but you seem so familar, you remind me of a bunch of other people I know, some of who I consider friends. Please continue to contribute your invaluable insight, after all its people like you who truly make a positive difference.

Cheers!

 

Moderating comments makes more sense than disabling them, imo. Some members yearn to disable comments largely so they can strive to 'win' big without questions or challenges ever being raised regarding their shotty offers. Another recent thread on this made that painfully clear, imo.

Those determined to 'win' big hope to snare inexperienced & naive members. I doubt that many of us object to seeing these sharks challenged on their bs offers.

A lively back & forth discussion indicates there are decent arguments for both sides of the offer. Such discussions never dissuade me from making the trade & without asking for more or better beer.

The majority of arguments against comments are to assist or protect the OP. While such a draconian solution might help the OPs, especially those whose purpose is to win, it undermines the community. Heckling, harassing, nitpicking comments can be removed by moderators. Members who comment inappropriately or excessively can be warned or given a timeout.

OPs deserve, & in some cases perhaps need protection, but so do the most vulnerable members. It is precisely these members who are targeted by the sharks. Removing the ability to publicly challenge the sharks is just a bad idea.

 

@JavaNoire that's always going to be the excuse for not disabling comments, but how many of these so called protective posts are legit? Pretty much zero. Most threadshitters are only advocates for their own benefit, not the benefit of others. That's also why there is a probationary period so the member has time to look through the ISO FT posts to see what the typical offers are. Also, how many "n00bs" come on here, have significant bottles of value and end up getting completely *****? These so called sharks are just an imaginary scapegoat to try to keep comments so people can continue to protect the value of their beers and what they traded for them. Look at 99.999% of the comments, completely useless.

 

I've had several bottles of Coffee Abraxas & never realized there was a 'best by' date on the bottle <blush>.

Had I known, I still would have traded for the last couple that I got, which were past the date. Fresh, it was way too coffee forward for my tastes. The last time I had it, which was well past the date, it was still much more coffee forward than I care for.

Had I known about the date I would have informed those I traded bottles to. I doubt it would have mattered as they were experienced traders who undoubtedly expect that coffee adjuncts might fall off whether it not the bottles are actually dated. Imo, dating the bottles was just silly *shrug*.

I believe Coffee Abraxas has only been released once. This is a different situation than say Pseudo Sue which has been brewed & bottled numerous times. Or KBS which is an annual release. Imo, anyone trading away PS or KBS should note if it's not the most recent release.

 

I can understand your guys concern though. Gotta make sure the guy who hit refresh 100 times on BPT, waited in line for 2 hours or paid $200 for a bottle release dinner can get the max value for his bottles because they are so uniformed since your buddy was able to score 6 Jester King fruited sours for his DBH and shouldn't settle for only 5. /sarcasm

 

@amsguitarist if there was one thing I could eliminate from this site, it would be the corrosive & rampant regionalism. Some of it is intended to hype one's bottles but a lot of it is simply mindless 'patriotism'. You know, the mindset that *Your* bottle is all about the hype while mine is the Holy Grail of brews.

Unfortunately, too many comments are mired in this mindless regional patriotism.

Imo, protection isn't an excuse. It's a legitimate reason to allow, even encourage comments, while moderating them. Well considered remarks, including reasonable debate, enhance rather than hurt the trading forums. Honest people making bad offers want to know. Honest people making decent offers shouldn't fear challenges or debates.

I think we'd see far more badly unbalanced offers if comments were disabled. Such offers would be unquestioned, unchallenged & without debate, which would be very bad, imo.

Despite having made 100+ trades I'm lousy at assessing what various beers should trade for. In part this is because Iowa has lousy distinction & gets very little of value. Nor do we produce many high demand beers, TG being the notable exception.

Comments in the trade forum have helped to alleviate this somewhat. They've also helped me grasp just how poor I am which is useful to know. I truly think it would hurt far more than it would help to lose them.