Warnings on threadshitting

I do feel that some mods enjoy being in the "power position" and give warnings out more than they should, and for undeserved reasons. On the flip side, it's "their" site, and their prerogative. I've decided to stop commenting on trades entirely, which may be their goal.

 

Fortunately, many people have spoke up about not wanting comments because of thread shitting, in multiple threads about this topic and only about three people continue to crusade for thread shitting, in all of those threads. No one should know who you're trading with or what deal went final, until its final. If you want to trade, go ahead, do you're research first or have an idea of what you want, ask your beer savvy friends, like we all have done in the beginning. Crickets are the sound of you needing to add or reevaluate your deal or someone will PM you and tell you, you need to add (Which I now do) despite the mechanism of trade trolls going in and out of threads with their own opinions of value. My ******** doesn't have a bunch of guys going "That DBH is way over priced!" Its just not selling, which means time to wait, if you feel its worth that much because of past sellers or its time to drop the price. They never needed anyone to verbally say that.

Now, you can immediately jump to some of my posted trades for a strategic rebuttal on me because I trade BOXES of beer for 1 bottle, all the time if I can, like the last thread or you can look at my trade rating at 100%, whether there is a 100 trades or 30 trades, its still complete satisfaction. The site can take care of itself because of us letting the moderators know but taking it into your own hands by thread shitting is not appropriate for this site as it has been clearly stated. The majority of people do not like that. Continue to spin it any way you want. Like the moderators said, there are other websites that encourage this but as you can see here in BeerAdvocate, its gotten out of hand and it's no longer appropriate if the moderators have to keep revisting this issue.

Last week, a guy commented in a trade using a rating percentage of 48 ratings compared to a rating percentage of 148 ratings for both beers being traded and the difference was .2%, he valued the 48 higher; which is a perfect example of unnecessary nonsense, which then sparked a thread argument take over in the ISO:FT.

 

I can respect that but I'm not blaming it ALL on trade comments. There's several factors involved that are out of our control but comments are in our control so why not try to help the problem and not contribute to it, even if its just a drop in the bucket?

That's akin to saying people will always get fucked over in trades so why even bother with a feedback system. Just because it will always continue doesn't mean we have to tolerate it or turn a blind eye. Can't we all hold hands and try to make BA and the world a better place?

 

I could get behind the no comments idea, but it is your last point that I question - why should anyone ever know what trades got done for what? If we lock down comments on the forums, I for one would also advocate locking/banning any "what trades got done for X" type threads, and have no public mechanism for trade tracking.

I see the "what does X go for" and 'closed' as potentially open to the same hyping of beers & thread shitting that goes on in the actual ISO forum. Either it is a open system or a closed off silent one - having a mechanism to track "completed trade values" (however that may be) is super prone to being exploited by traders hyping new beers - what is there to stop people creating hype or protecting their trade values by posting fake trades than then 'close' a few hours later?

 

I like trade tracking, if the people want to keep track. Theres always loop holes and scammers, like @cfh64 has said, in every aspect of life but there are people that want that beer that you have and there are beers that you want and if the deal is good, the deal is good. We have threads in this section that show what has traded for what. I doubt someone is going to put something like 1 can of heady for Broken Truck, despite him saying thats what he closed on in a trade tracking thread because of necessary trolling. Naturally, I would want more and in the appropriate thread, its completely acceptable to be like "Dude, no" but not in the ISO:FT, where the issue is.

 

Will you start a blog? Although we disagree on this topic I'm always fascinated, yes fascinated, by your commentary.

I digress, in reference to your last paragraph...like you, I've been trading for awhile and my values are usually off one way or the other. It's not necessarily that I'm trying to be generous or take advantage of anyone, it's either I'm not up to date with current trade values or am only willing to give up what I'm comfortable with in exchange for what I want. If I get crickets that tells me all I need to know and I'll either adjust my offer or and/or do more research to get an idea of what's more in line.

Eh, fuck it, people are waiting on me. It's time to be the beautiful social butterfly I am I know for sure you've heard my argument a thousand times so I'll spare the rest...for now

 

@floridadrift be fair, please. Comments are not automatically threadshitting, nor are people crusading for threadshitting simply because they don't think comments should be disabled.

There is a site which permits comments with little to no moderation. Unfortunately, this results (imo) with less information rather than more. If an offer is frowned upon, or perhaps the OP is simply disliked, the thread devolves into pages of silliness and irrelevant remarks , ie unmitigated threadshitting. I find that frustrating as I'm mad curious as to what exactly is considered bad about the offer, what makes it seem unfair.

Someone offered an ISO:FT for 2 cases of bcbs for a BVDL which I think had to include some bcbcs. Many thought it was a ridiculous request because $4$ it was so unbalanced. I thought it was a great example of quantity for quality & would have loved to make the trade if I'd had enough BCBS.

The various opinions didn't derail the offer which was readily completed. It generated controversy, especially among $4$ adherents, but others thought that it provided a worthwhile opportunity for some lucky devil to acquire BVDL despite not having whalez or near whalez to trade for it.

Neither the opponents, nor the supporters of the trade were 'wrong'. Both provided worthwhile perspectives & overall enriched the community, imo. Decent offers rarely have much to fear from open discussion.

 

@cfh64 I'm blushing. That was a very nice thing to say. And I think you'll understand when I say that I usually learn more from well presented disagreement than I do from those who agree with me.

I understand things to do, lol. I'm with my daughter this week, who limits my computer time, especially BA computer time.

 

I'm not saying comments should or shouldn't be allowed. But to say crickets are the sound meaning you need to add is nonsense. Fair trades get posted everyday, OVERLY fair trades get posted every day, and people get crickets.

 

What I don't get is the people claiming they need comments because they "don't know what to add". In my personal opinion, comments are unnecessary. Why? If I need to add, nobody will offer me anything OR someone who is interested will PM me and say "Hey I'll do this if you can add XX bottle".

Most of what you guys are saying can be done via PM. Why can't you just offer what you think the bottle is worth via completed trades history? Boggles my mind that this is so difficult to convince people of. Lopsided trades happens as it is. Common sense should tell you, if you get a lot of messages, you are probably generous, crickets you need to add, and 3 to 4 messages probably spot on.

 

@Catchy_Name I don't understand why you should be upset or feel the need to tell someone off for a lowball offer. If it's a lowball offer, then he should get crickets. I honestly think maybe you're worried somebody will agree to it, set a precedent for Velvet Speedway and devalue a bottle you might end up getting. All what's wrong with threadshitting.

 

I agree, like someone else said, sometimes its just a waiting game, as I reiterated; sometimes its just not what people want at that time, the crickets have two meanings. When my inbox fills up, sometimes the trades are very big but I don't want those bottles.

I would have to agree, as well, I would of also done that trade but with 1 case if I wanted it that bad and I would of waited for the right trader but they didn't need any commentary, at all, because they weren't involved.

I wanted to add on my last post, I absolutely understand where you're coming from @JavaNoire, we all do but threadshitting only applies to the ISO:FT, not to any other type of thread, so feel free to create a thread that pertains to past trades and tips for trading with all of this information, its encouraged, label it: "NEWB TRADING MUST READ", which our new members should be searching for anyway.

I'm sure you've been helpful and people have been helpful, like myself, in the ISO:FT but what's happening is people are becoming more unhelpful because of nonsense opinions in the ISO:FT, where the next level of Advocates are, the ones who search and read and don't have any probationary periods set in stone by the moderators for trading for collectors items that aren't available to them.

 

Why are they unrealistic? Because a bunch of asshats who arbitrarily determine their beer should be "worth" more say so? Based on what? numbers? what the last bottle traded for?

I guess everyone who is looking for a bottle of VS that doesn't meet your standards is greedy. This is when I should bite my tougue...and I will, for once.

Edit: Perhaps your right, anyone who values beers differently then you do is a "greedy asshole". Your attitude is spot on, if only we all valued beers and trading the same as you.

 

Lol, ok. Holy fuck! I'll be blunt, either your a troll or your the problem. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and go with both. Please leave.

 

Its sad beer trading has come to this and a lot of BA's mindsets are heading in this direction. Low bottle count is all that matters, not taste. Trade it for the highest price, don't trade it to actually share with others or actually make a viable trade partner and friend. It really is turning to a *stock market* with every new release...I mean *insta-whale*.
Maybe I'll stick to BIF's where everyone sends great beers from their cellars without a blink of an eye to a stranger states away. Where the beers sent aren't gauged on bottle count, cost,etc, but rather hits your targets wants and wish lists. That's the type of mindset I wish more BA's had. Most importantly, there is no thread shitting in those forums.

 

Don't entertain him any further. Glancing through his post history I'm surprised he's been around this long. What a benefit to the site!

 

He already answered it Brad.

 

Yup, I'm easy. I took the bait hook, line and sinker. If only there weren't a computer screen and the law separating us...

 

Just in case anyone has any doubts, here are all the comments (excluding those by the OP) on the first page and assuming they're not deleted. Someone please tell me how the majority, or even two, of these are beneficial.

http://www.beeradvocate.com/community/threads/iso-cd14-florence-ft-sp-pulling-nails-b3.315857/

http://www.beeradvocate.com/community/threads/iso-list-ft-list.315850/

http://www.beeradvocate.com/communi...y-stout-ft-vermont-hops-heady-sos-etc.315842/

http://www.beeradvocate.com/community/threads/ft-fff-rue-dfloyd-iso-prop-or-vanilla-rye.315836/

http://www.beeradvocate.com/community/threads/iso-vr-ft-pick-5.315828/

http://www.beeradvocate.com/community/threads/iso-cd14-ft-st-lam-backyard-list.315825/

 

Admitting to trolling all the time coupled with the fact that this thread is actively involves the input of multiple mods makes this quite the spectacle. Clear violation of the rules here.