What exactly is a West Coast IPA (WCIPA)?

Discussion in 'Beer Talk' started by JackHorzempa, Oct 26, 2023.

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  1. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,375) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Society Pooh-Bah

    There seems to a lot of enthusiasm in the “Is anyone else tired of false WCIPAs?” thread concerning the so-called West Coast IPA sub-style so I figured it would be worthwhile to take a deep dive into what is a ‘true’ WCIPA.

    Does an IPA need to be pale in color to be a ‘true’ WCIPA?

    Does the beer need to be bitter (e.g., > 50 IBUs) to be a ‘true’ WCIPA?

    Does the malt flavor need to be little/none for it is be a ‘true’ WCIPA?

    Does the beer need to feature aromas/flavors of pine to be a ‘true’ WCIPA?

    Etc?

    Do all of the above attributes (and others?) need to be present to be a ‘true’ WCIPA?

    What do y’all think on this interesting concept?

    Cheers!

    P.S. It may be of interest that there was a thread entitled “Suggestions: add WCIPA as a style and notes when adding a beer” in the Meta forum. That thread is now locked.
     
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  2. Orca

    Orca Grand Pooh-Bah (4,710) Sep 18, 2010 Washington
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Here’s my take.
    • Color: Pale to amber is most common.
    • IBUs: 50 sounds pretty low, but you definitely need a pronounced bitterness/acidity.
    • Malt presence: Malt should be fairly neutral but malt flavor is essential (otherwise all you’d have is hop tea)—hop flavor/aroma is the focus but the malt should complement that.
    • Pine: Certainly common but not essential. WCIPAs can be citrusy, resinous, piney, or any combination.
    • Other factors: It needs to be clear.
     
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  3. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,375) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Society Pooh-Bah

    What minimum amount of IBUs would you select for your style guideline?

    Cheers!
     
  4. DoctorZombies

    DoctorZombies Grand High Pooh-Bah (6,887) Feb 1, 2015 Florida
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    Great question! I’m interested in how you answer all your questions.

    Cheers!
     
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  5. BBThunderbolt

    BBThunderbolt Grand High Pooh-Bah (7,846) Sep 24, 2007 Kiribati
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    I would add the malt ought to lean more towards grain than sweetness. An a touch of rye for added bite and dryness is always welcome too.
     
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  6. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,375) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Society Pooh-Bah

    Touché!

    I will eventually contribute my thoughts later in this thread but I figured I would let others post (e.g., @draheim) without me overly influencing things.

    At this exact moment in time (i.e. 1:16 pm Eastern Time 10/26/23) I am sorta inclined to just use a 'generic' sub-style name of American IPA (akin to BeerAdvocate and the BJCP) which would be broad(er) in nature.

    But I reserve my right to change my mind here.:wink:

    Cheers!
     
  7. Domingo

    Domingo Grand Pooh-Bah (4,252) Apr 23, 2005 Colorado
    Pooh-Bah

    I wish we'd just drop that term. There were plenty of breweries along the west coast that were brewing an entirely different style of IPA when that name was coined. Now? There are plenty of breweries in San Diego making "New England" IPA. This isn't as bad as Italian Pilsner, but I'd like to see these regional descriptors go away.
     
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  8. TrojanRB

    TrojanRB Grand Pooh-Bah (3,779) Jul 27, 2013 Texas
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    I think you nailed it.
     
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  9. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,375) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Society Pooh-Bah

    That is kinda where I an sitting right now. But based upon the number of posts in the other thread there seems to quite a bit of enthusiasm for WCIPA.
    My preferred terminology here is Juicy/Hazy IPA but it seems that most folks prefer to call these sorts of beers New England IPA so....
    Italian Pilsner is egregious. An Italian Pilsner is just a German Pilsner that includes dry hopping. Some German breweries have dry hopped their Pilsners for generations. Just because Agostino Arioli decided to dry hop his Pilsner (Tipopils) in 1996 doesn't change history here.

    Cheers!
     
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  10. DoctorZombies

    DoctorZombies Grand High Pooh-Bah (6,887) Feb 1, 2015 Florida
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    Well stated!

    Just me, I think the BJCP covers the ground work for American IPA well…

    I, too, look forward to how this most interesting discussion unfolds…

    Cheers!
     
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  11. Shanex

    Shanex Grand Pooh-Bah (4,960) Dec 10, 2015 France
    Mod Team Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    I know it’s a Pale Ale, but Sierra Nevada Pale Ale is as close as possible to a great WCIPA, a cousin of sort.

    What @draheim said also nails it for me.
     
  12. Orca

    Orca Grand Pooh-Bah (4,710) Sep 18, 2010 Washington
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    I dunno, maybe 60 or 65? I don't pay attention to numbers like that very carefully, I just think 50 sounds low.
     
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  13. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,375) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Society Pooh-Bah

    In case you are wondering I selecting 50 IBUs as an example since that is the lower limit for the BA American IPA style guideline. In contrast BJCP uses 40 IBUs as the lower limit for American IPA.

    Cheers!
     
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  14. Orca

    Orca Grand Pooh-Bah (4,710) Sep 18, 2010 Washington
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Fair enough. Off the top of my head, here are IBUs for a few of what I consider classic/old school West Coast IPAs:
    • Stone IPA: 71
    • Sculpin: 70
    • Blind Pig: 70
    • Lagunitas IPA: 52
    • Alpine Nelson: 45
    So maybe 40 or 50 is reasonable for a minimum number, even if many go substantially above that.
     
    #14 Orca, Oct 26, 2023
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2023
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  15. laketang

    laketang Grand Pooh-Bah (3,017) Mar 22, 2015 Arizona
    Pooh-Bah

    Lots of hops in boil. La cumbre elevated has 100 ibu's for example. It is listed as an American ipa, but wcipa is considered a branch off of that category. I'm probably completely wrong.
     
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  16. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,375) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Society Pooh-Bah

    Not according to BeerAdvocate (today) and the BJCP style guidelines since there is no such thing as a WCIPA there.

    Cheers!
     
  17. AlcahueteJ

    AlcahueteJ Grand Pooh-Bah (3,242) Dec 4, 2004 Massachusetts
    Society Pooh-Bah

    This is a solid example, but more of a precursor. A lot of the characteristics are there, but it only has 38 IBUs...

    To me a sweet caramel malt back bone specifically to slightly balance things out a bit is a hallmark, but that's just me.

    I also agree that just using American IPA would suffice. There's varying degrees of American IPA that eventually blur the lines towards New England IPA, but those are really the two sub styles.
     
  18. unlikelyspiderperson

    unlikelyspiderperson Grand Pooh-Bah (3,966) Mar 12, 2013 California
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Put me in the camp that finds the designation increasingly meaningless. But if I were to try and recreate the attributes that lead people to make a distinction I would guess that the American ipa developed as a beer that was heavily hopped with C hops and balanced witha caramel malt body. It seems like the contribution of the "west coast" was to thin the body out and shift the balance of hops later in the process to maintain the sweet/bitter balance.

    This is also the path that california ipa brewers have continued down in my experience. Most of the ipas I drink these days have a very lean malt bill that is definitely more grainy/biscuity than caramel sweet and they make liberal use of late addition aroma hops to provide the primary flavor with the pine/pith bitterness in the finish to keep things clean.
     
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  19. laketang

    laketang Grand Pooh-Bah (3,017) Mar 22, 2015 Arizona
    Pooh-Bah

    Yeah I looked up that info elsewhere.
     
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  20. Orca

    Orca Grand Pooh-Bah (4,710) Sep 18, 2010 Washington
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    If you were going to split off West Coast from American (and I’m not saying we should), then I think the wedge you would use to do it would relate to the malt. When you start using words like “sweet,” “caramel,” and “balance” I think you are talking about the more traditional American IPA, whereas when you use words like “dry” or grainy/biscuity you are more likely talking about a West Coast IPA. I’m fine keeping them all together under the American IPA classification, but then West Coast would be a sub-classification under that. But I also think that’s what they should have done with New England/hazy IPAs, and that horse is already out of the barn.
     
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