Why no Love for Stone?

Discussion in 'Beer Talk' started by dcgunman, Jun 10, 2017.

  1. jesskidden

    jesskidden Meyvn (1,256) Aug 10, 2005 New Jersey

    Yeah, that was similar to my first impression:
    "Reminds me of a long-ago malt liquor..."
    (Maybe Molson Brador?)

    Up until not too long ago (TTB COLA dated 2004) FAXE was still being imported into the US in those large cans.
    LuskusDelph, drtth and herrburgess like this.
  2. JimKal

    JimKal Zealot (510) Jul 31, 2011 North Carolina

    Jack, as one of the poor misguided souls that said Wussie was my favorite Pilsner, I appreciate your post. I looked at the style guidelines on this site for Euro Strong Lager and Aussie at 5.8% abv is well below the 7 to 10% mentioned. Certainly below the 10%abv mentioned for Faxe. In reading your post it seems that it may no be your favorite but I will say my liking Wussie is encouraging me to try some of the other Pilsners that are appearing. I've just picked up and tried Sixpoint's "The Crisp" and enjoyed it - not as much as Wussie but I did enjoy it. Summer seems like such a good time to explore Pilsner and other lagers. I look forward to further recommendations from you on ones to try.
  3. JuicesFlowing

    JuicesFlowing Poo-Bah (2,115) Jul 5, 2009 Kansas

    The first Stone beer I had was simply their IPA and I think it's excellent along with Xocoveza. Their smoked Porter with chili peppers was very good. The reason I don't dabble in the rest of their lineup is because like a lot of breweries today they seem fixated on hops and IPAs and I'm so sick of that mentality. They seem like the type of brewery that would over-hop a ESB and ruin it. They don't brew traditional styles or if they do there aren't distributed in my region. But at least they don't necessarily have the stigma of "every beer tastes the same" like another brewery I know.
  4. herrburgess

    herrburgess Meyvn (1,043) Nov 4, 2009 South Carolina
    Industry Beer Trader

    I should have clarified...Wussie tasted like the middle between the "regular" FAXE and the stronger versions. Didn't know we were sticking to strict definitions. Please feel free to try the FAXE beers and decide for yourself.
    JimKal likes this.
  5. Highbrow

    Highbrow Devotee (476) Jan 7, 2011 California
    Beer Trader

    i loved the Smoked Porter with Chipotle if that's the one you are talking about? not just Stone specifically, but like you, i am tired of everything must be hopped which that issue seems to be affecting what iterations we are seeing (or no longer seeing) from Stone. lastly. every beer tastes the same? in my mind, was that a crack at Lagunitas?
  6. WV_Charles_Homebrew

    WV_Charles_Homebrew Initiate (131) May 17, 2017 West Virginia

    I was in New Orleans last week and stopped at Steins Deli and bottle shop. They had several bottles of Old Stone agers in the beer shed in the back--Old Guardian 2014, 2015, 2016 and the Russian Imperial Stout. I was going to buy a bottle of each but then the daughter had her eye on a Whale and I had to make some hard choices in order to stay on budget. Ended up only getting a bottle of OG 2016 since that was the one I have not tried. But if anyone is in NOLA...they probably still have some and freshness is not such a big deal with these.
  7. lpteague

    lpteague Initiate (124) Dec 11, 2009 North Carolina

    I was in San Fran recently and visited toronado. Had Pliny the Elder on tap and it was excellent. Got home and a buddy had given me a sixer of ruination 2.0. To me, ruination was a better IPA. I know it doesn't get the hype given its wide distribution , but it is an amazing beer.
  8. Lahey

    Lahey Aspirant (285) Nov 12, 2016 Michigan

    Seems like other than enjoy by (which is expensive), the only other beers people look for aren't readily available. I saw one wootstout and xoco before i knew what they were, but haven't seen since. I haven't tried their RIS, because lagunitas has a bomber right next to it for 2-3 dollars cheaper. I do enjoy "enjoy by", but they need to reinvent the wheel and make it readily available to get attention.
  9. CHickman

    CHickman Poo-Bah (2,661) Jan 7, 2009 New York

    I agree as I too love Stone. They have made some "forgettable" beers, but overall I think they have an impressive body of work and staying power. The Enjoy By series is great, Arrogant Bastard is a craft classic, the Bastard family is generally always good, the W00tstout series is great, they make a very above average RIS and Fyodor's Bourbon Barrel Aged RIS was one of my all time favorite beers. They have had some duds over the past 2 years (like Go To IPA...), but have also put out some gems like Pataskala Red IPA, cranked out the RuinTen and Ruination and re-released for their 20th anniversary Sublimely Self-Righteous Black IPA. I'm still a fan and can't wait to pick up my magnum's after they're bottled.
    peteboiler and HorseheadsHophead like this.
  10. raynmoon

    raynmoon Crusader (743) Aug 13, 2011 Colorado
    Beer Trader

    Stone was on every craft beer buyer's mind for years and suddenly they've began to drift away from that spotlight by producing fruited IPAs and only IPAs on their portfolio.

    A lot of us are moving on. We hope Stone comes back, or I'm not sure what they end up.
  11. R_i_P

    R_i_P Initiate (168) Jan 30, 2017 California

    What I dig about Stone Brewing is that they apparently have a $100 million "True Craft" financial program that invests specifically into small, independent breweries looking for outside investment of less than 25% of their companies, with a stated goal to "allow brewers to continue to operate independently without having to borrow from banks, sell to traditional venture capitalists, or sell to multinational conglomerates."

    Now that's something that I can love about Stone -- they promote the best part of today's craft brewing industry -- pioneering, innovative and creative with an emphasis on high quality. I support small, independent breweries with the vision to be the best. Forget fine wine, I'll take a finely crafted brew every time.
  12. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Poo-Bah (3,447) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Premium Member

    I remember reading about this venture a year or so ago but I have not heard or read about a single investment that has been consummated.

    Can you share more information here?


    Prince_Casual likes this.
  13. drtth

    drtth Poo-Bah (3,371) Nov 25, 2007 Pennsylvania

    Good point and exellent question.

    Especially in the context of Lagunitas having acquired a minority ownership in Shorts. Such low percentage acquistions were part of the intent of the Stone proposed venture.
    FBarber likes this.
  14. offthelevel_bytheplumb

    offthelevel_bytheplumb Devotee (454) Aug 19, 2013 Illinois

    I think Stone's RIS is far superior to Lagunitas. It's definitely worth a try.
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  15. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Poo-Bah (3,447) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Premium Member

    But Stone decided to not produce their Imperial Russian Stout in 2017 so how is Lahey going to try it?

  16. offthelevel_bytheplumb

    offthelevel_bytheplumb Devotee (454) Aug 19, 2013 Illinois

    This is news to me.
  17. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Poo-Bah (3,447) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Premium Member

  18. offthelevel_bytheplumb

    offthelevel_bytheplumb Devotee (454) Aug 19, 2013 Illinois

  19. neenerzig

    neenerzig Poo-Bah (1,802) Feb 15, 2006 Ohio

    Well, I sure still love Stone, and have ever since I first discovered them going on 14 years ago now a few days after I turned 21. Still the best brewery as far as crafting IPAs go in my opinion. And they make some amazing non IPA style beer too!

    ebin6 likes this.
  20. CheapHysterics

    CheapHysterics Aspirant (254) Apr 1, 2009 Pennsylvania

    Been kind of indifferent to them ever since they stopped brewing their smoked porter. Loved that beer.
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  21. mschofield

    mschofield Meyvn (1,349) Oct 16, 2002 Massachusetts

    I think the Dogfish thing is spot on. They make very good beers, but I don't buy them as often as 15-20 years ago, there are so many local brewers, the only national brand I ever pick up is Sierra Nevada.
  22. dcall384

    dcall384 Aspirant (249) Aug 9, 2011 Indiana

    I tend to pass on them because here in Indiana the prices are a little too much for me. Most of their year round beers are $12 a 6 pack. That is a little high I think.
    peteboiler likes this.
  23. EvenMoreJesus

    EvenMoreJesus Champion (824) Jun 8, 2017 Pennsylvania
    Premium Member

    "I think they are the Dogfish of the West Coast."

    Outside of them both being around for over 20 years, I find that there are very few similarities. Although both have solid year-round line-ups, I like Stone's a lot better than DFH's, as Stone actually seems to be concerned with changing consumer tastes. Stone also puts out FAR less novelty beer than does DFH, which is a wonderful thing, IMO.
    ebin6, jakecattleco and montman like this.
  24. Leebo

    Leebo Initiate (178) Feb 7, 2013 Massachusetts

    Stone? I have better, local for less $$, so there's that.
    beergoot likes this.
  25. EvenMoreJesus

    EvenMoreJesus Champion (824) Jun 8, 2017 Pennsylvania
    Premium Member

    Curious as to which locals in Mass. are making better beer for a lower price than Stone.
    PA-Michigander likes this.
  26. Leebo

    Leebo Initiate (178) Feb 7, 2013 Massachusetts

    ^^^ PA? No wonder. And fresher. Start with Jacks Abby, Night Shift, Cambridge brewing. Only my palate matters. With the exception of Sierra Nevada and Rodenbach, I only drink New England, why stray from the best? Sort of like people I meet from NY, I usually have an immediate distrust of them at first, they might be yankees fans. ( Wink, wink, ducks behind cover of keg now)
  27. EvenMoreJesus

    EvenMoreJesus Champion (824) Jun 8, 2017 Pennsylvania
    Premium Member

    Ehh . . . our laws aren't nearly as restrictive as they used to be just a few years ago.

    I would agree that those breweries are probably getting you beer fresher, but Stone does pretty well with that.

    Better? Yeah . . . that's pretty subjective, like you said, but Stone is no slouch as far as providing a wide variety of beers, outside of their year-round line-up, that is, which is exclusively IPAs/hoppy beers.

    As far as price point goes, Stone is definitely not the cheapest out there, but I think the breweries that you mentioned are still coming in over what Stone charges. Not sure on that, though, so feel free to correct me.
    R_i_P likes this.
  28. mschofield

    mschofield Meyvn (1,349) Oct 16, 2002 Massachusetts

    Not in style of beer, although Stone has certainly made enough beers with off centered ingredients. But they're large and brought craft into a lot of areas. They occupy the same market niche.
    EvenMoreJesus likes this.
  29. Leebo

    Leebo Initiate (178) Feb 7, 2013 Massachusetts

    Not buyin no left coast junk. Was gifted a 22 of enjoy by recently. Was good. Night Shift Santilli won gold in the world beer cup against 280 or so in the " American IPA Category" so there's that. And it is 2 days to 2 weeks old , max for most of my stuff. I have so many, so fresh, so good and local breweries right near by. I would venture 50 within 50 miles. And I haven't tried them all. My desire to try CA brews that are older? Zero. In my fridge? Austin st patina, 3 different Night Shifts, some Alchemist heady topper and their stout, Foundation afterglow, Wachusetts' wally and some Notch left of the dial. That's just what I can think of. I need stone because? Not. Limited bandwidth. Oh and some leftover Zero Gravity cone head from my bike trip.
    EvenMoreJesus likes this.
  30. ZAP

    ZAP Poo-Bah (3,577) Dec 1, 2001 Minnesota

    I agree with this but pricing wise in our state they are a bit above most and while I will pull the trigger occasionally I do not think their product is THAT great to include it regularly in my lineup...same with Alesmith up here in Minnysota..
  31. Lahey

    Lahey Aspirant (285) Nov 12, 2016 Michigan

    I complained about never seeing wootstout on the shelves, then 2 days later found 10 of them on my favorite stores shelf. Complaint redacted.
  32. R_i_P

    R_i_P Initiate (168) Jan 30, 2017 California

    @JackHorzempa -- Fair enough: I'll look into Stone's "True Craft" financial program a little further to see what I can learn. I come from a financial background, so I'd find this interesting. If I were a talented brewmaster looking to start my own independent brewery, I'd definitely take a keen interest in Stone's program -- or at least its potential. I read about Stone's financial program in a more recent article than the one you read. Nevertheless, I know as much as you do. Like you, I don't know of a single investment that Stone has consummated, which isn't to suggest that there have been none. Regardless, I like the spirit behind the concept, particularly since I strongly support local, independent breweries here in California (at least in drinking their creations :wink:).
    #232 R_i_P, Aug 1, 2017
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2017
  33. Lahey

    Lahey Aspirant (285) Nov 12, 2016 Michigan

    Ive seen it in the stores from 2016 quite a bit. That's why i havent tried it, i figured if it's not selling well it must not be good. Plus big bad baptist hangs out next to it and that usually gets my high end stout money. I will try it now though because of your recommendation. Thanks!
    JackHorzempa likes this.
  34. HorseheadsHophead

    HorseheadsHophead Meyvn (1,279) Sep 15, 2014 New York

    As good as Stone's IPAs are, anymore I realize that some of their best beers are their dark malty beers. Xocoveza, W00tstout, and RIS are incredible, and Coffee Milk is also very well done. Interestingly enough, Citrusy Wit was of my favorite Stone beers in the past few years. I haven't seen it yet this summer, though. Does anyone know if they're still going to brew it?
    ebin6, LuskusDelph and jakecattleco like this.
  35. huthuty

    huthuty Disciple (334) Jun 7, 2017 Utah
    Beer Trader

    Their flagship IPA is only ok. Stone Ripper is good. Nothing really sticks out about them
  36. dripa8

    dripa8 Aspirant (247) Sep 19, 2014 Kansas
    Beer Trader

    @huthuty , seeing as how you rated stone's beers between 4.08 to 4.75, which means outstanding to world class, I'm surprised you'd have the nuts to now run them down. As a neophyte you really don't have the heft to give a negative opinion when you already ranked them so high. Besides you ranked natural ice a 3.95.?????
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  37. huthuty

    huthuty Disciple (334) Jun 7, 2017 Utah
    Beer Trader

    i really like the style *shrug* just way better IPAs out there
    also, natty ice is boss, fight me
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  38. dripa8

    dripa8 Aspirant (247) Sep 19, 2014 Kansas
    Beer Trader

    :slight_smile: just calls em as I sees em. Arrogant bastard is not an IPA by the way
  39. huthuty

    huthuty Disciple (334) Jun 7, 2017 Utah
    Beer Trader

    did i say it was?
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  40. dripa8

    dripa8 Aspirant (247) Sep 19, 2014 Kansas
    Beer Trader

    Cmon @huhuty, its no crime to be new to craft. I just took offense that you could rate a few beers so high, then run down one of the originators of craft beer who were doing it while you were in grade school. Just keep a little perspective in the future. You can go back to malt liquor for all I care.