Hey folks. Have a couple questions about yeast for my upcoming brew. I think I know the answer to the first, but figured I should get some other opinions. Brewing a clone of Russian River's Consecration, based from the MoreBeer kit - I brewed that as was a while back and I'm really happy with it - I'm doing it again getting the stuff myself, with a couple minor modifications. So the first question is: I have my starter for the primary (Wyeast 1214 - Belgian Abbey) going now, if I want to save some for another brew - it smells great even in the starter - am I better off taking some from the starter or waiting till primary is done and harvesting there? Second: For the souring, I got a can of the Imperial Organic SourBatchKids ready-to-pitch. First, has anyone used this blend? The guy at the shop said it's really good. I do plan to pitch a couple sets of dregs as well, from a Fiddlehead sour I saved and probably from a Tilquin Geuze I have. If I want to save some of that, should I mix them together in a second (sanitized, of course) jar and take from there, or again wait till I bottle? Keeping in mind this might be a year from now. Also, is the cans too much bugs to pitch? I've always read they should be stressed a bit to get the best funkiness.
Sounds like a cool project! Are you positive that those dregs have the bugs you are looking for? I consult this list with any dregs I pitch. http://www.themadfermentationist.com/p/dreg-list.html
You definitely want to take from starter. This is easier and you are more likely to get a true cross section of the early-flocc'ers & top-crop'ers. Plus, the little buggers never go through the stress of primary fermentation and sanitation is easier to manage. Before decanting from starter give it a hard shake, then pour off your keeper-yeast.
I am not familiar with the Sour batch kids you speak of. But I would follow the directions on package. If it says pitch the whole thing, do it. As far as dregs- just pitch straight from the bottle. Just throw them in at start of primary or dump some in later if that's when you drink them.
From their website: "Sour Batch Kidz is a blend of low attenuating Belgian saison yeast, Lactobacillus, and two Brettanomyces yeast strains." What does your recipe look like? If you've got more than low single digit IBUs, you're probably not going to get much acidity from this blend. I would not wait until you bottle as those dregs, very probably, contain different microbes than the Imperial blend, so you're going to get additional fermentation when you pitch them because they can utilize different carbon sources. Any reason that you want to age it a year? Stress doesn't get you "funk" or brett. character. Phenolic precursors do. If you post a working recipe, we can work through it with you and reverse engineer a recipe from what you want your beer to taste like.
The grain bill is 12lbs - 11 2-row, 8oz Acidulated, 4oz Carafa and 4oz Special B, plus a pound each of Dark Belgian Candi Syrup and corn sugar. Hops are .5oz Styrian Goldings at 90min, 1oz Sterling at 30 and 1oz sterling at 1min. I've brewed this recipe before - it's basically a kit from MoreBeer, I've making a couple changes that have nothing to do with the yeast. I can't find my notes to see what the souring blend I used before was, but I have a vial from White Labs Belgian Sour mix 1, the WLP655, so that's probably what I used. I'm really happy with how that turned out. I'm more thinking about when I can harvest the dregs to save them for another time, not adding the bottle dregs. I'd toss those in at the same time. My question is, if I want to save that blend, should I mix together, take some and add the rest to the secondary, or add every thing, then when I bottle, a year or whenever from now (it took a year till I was happy last time, so that's what I'm estimating - planning on checking every few months during souring.) take what I can get from the bottom of the secondary fermenter. That's answering my second question about how much bugs to pitch, thanks. This is a much bigger pitch from the last one I did.
That should provide enough phenolic precursors to get the brett character that you desire. Yeah, I would all but guarantee that you're going to completely inhibit the lactobacillus in that Imperial blend with your hop schedule. That blend has Pediococcus damnosis in it, which is very hop tolerant, as opposed to the Imperial blend which has only lactobacillus, which is not. The Tilquin dregs should have pedio in it, though. Not sure about the Fiddlehead. I'd pitch them with your initial souring blend. Harvest them whenever you want, just know that you will probably get at least a slightly different product when you pitch all your microbes at the same time versus staggering the pitches. In all reality, the growth rate of the individual microbes has more to do with the final character of the beer than does the percentages of the consitituent microbes that you pitch.
