Averagely Perfect American Brown Ale - Poll #9 - Crystal Malts Cont.

Discussion in 'Homebrewing' started by VikeMan, Mar 26, 2019.

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Which C-Malts should advance to the combo poll, inseparably with Pale Chocolate Malt (English ~220L)

Poll closed Mar 28, 2019.

  1. American Crystal 60

    5 vote(s)
    14.7%

  2. American Crystal 60 AND Simpsons Double Roasted Crystal (~115L)

    2 vote(s)
    5.9%

  3. American Crystal 60 AND Golden Naked Oats

    14 vote(s)
    41.2%

  4. American Crystal 60 AND Simpsons Double Roasted Crystal (~115L) AND Golden Naked Oats

    13 vote(s)
    38.2%
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  1. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    Polls #8A and #8B determined that American Crystal 60 will be advancing, inseparably with Pale Chocolate Malt (English, ~220L), to a future combo poll that will feature at least one ingredient from "Amber Malt and/or Brown Malt" and at least one ingredient from "Other Adjuncts." Simpsons Double Roasted Crystal (~115L) and/or Golden Naked Oats may also be advancing to the combo poll, riding along with the American Crystal 60. This poll will determine that.

    This is a straight plurality poll.

    I recommend you think about this in terms of not only your personal preferences, but also in the context of the ABV and Final Gravity (and thus the attenuation) already selected, base malt already selected, and fermentables still possible, as well as any possible yeast strain selection that might be kicking around in your head.

    This poll will be open for 48 hours.

    If you have issues with or suggestions for methodologies used in this project, please send them via beermail. Let's keep the threads themselves on topic to the question at hand and not about how you would have asked the question differently.

    The Averagely Perfect American Brown Ale Recipe so far...

    Target ABV: 5.6%
    OG: 1.056
    FG: 1.013

    Grains/Fermentables:
    - Golden Promise: IN
    - Pale Chocolate Malt (English, ~220L); possibly in, along with American Crystal 60
    - American Crystal 60; possibly in, along with Pale Chocolate Malt (English, ~220L)
    - Simpsons Double Roasted Crystal (~115L) and/or Golden Naked Oats: possibly in, riding along with American Crystal 60
    - Amber Malt and/or Brown Malt: possibly in
    - Other Adjuncts: possibly in
     
    #1 VikeMan, Mar 26, 2019
  2. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    To clarify/reiterate: Whatever C-Malt(s) survive this poll go(es) on to the combo poll, locked together with Pale Chocolate and with each other (if more than one). e.g., if all three C-Malts survive, then all three, plus Pale Chocolate, will be in the final recipe, or none of them will. (This all assumes no remorse poll.)
     
    #2 VikeMan, Mar 26, 2019
  3. minderbender

    minderbender Initiate (0) Jan 18, 2009 New York

    Are we still going to get a chance to reject brown/amber malt entirely, or is some form of those malts definitely going to be in the recipe?

    I ask because the malt bill is getting to be a bit much in my opinion. If, as the numbers currently indicate, we end up with 3 crystal malts on top of the chocolate malt, I'm not sure I would support adding yet more.
     
    #3 minderbender, Mar 26, 2019
    dmtaylor likes this.
  4. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    Yes. Something(s) from Amber/Brown will advance to the combo poll. Same with something(s) for Other Adjuncts. At that point the Amber/Brown rep(s) can be "in" or excluded, as a unit. The Other Adjunct(s) rep(s) can be "in" or excluded, as a unit. And the inseparable Pale Chocolate/Crystal Malt(s) can be "in" or excluded, as a unit.
     
    #4 VikeMan, Mar 26, 2019
    minderbender likes this.
  5. minderbender

    minderbender Initiate (0) Jan 18, 2009 New York

    Okay so look, I think we're (almost) all going to want chocolate malt in this beer—in fact if I recall, that ballot was so lopsided as to make North Korean elections look competitive by comparison. And at this point chocolate malt is inseparable from whatever crystal malts we choose in the current poll. So we need to proceed with caution here.

    That said, to be honest, on consideration I'm fine with a complicated malt bill. But anyone who wants to keep things simple, and especially anyone who still wants to add brown or amber malt, or oats, or whatever, should think carefully about the ramifications of this poll.
     
    #5 minderbender, Mar 26, 2019
    GormBrewhouse likes this.
  6. Arturo2

    Arturo2 Initiate (0) Jan 6, 2019 Oregon

    Mine too.
    I hope people can see the forest for the trees.
    I'm not a statistician by any stretch, or pollster, but there's too many options IMO.
    C60 won.
    I feel like that choice is now lessened by offering the option for the 2nd/3rd place finishers to be added in conjunction. Of course everyone who voted for the others before will vote to add them again. What's the point then?
     
    #6 Arturo2, Mar 26, 2019
    dmtaylor likes this.
  7. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    The point is to narrow the context in which choices are being made.

     
    #7 VikeMan, Mar 26, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2019
    frozyn likes this.
  8. Dave_S

    Dave_S Crusader (429) May 18, 2017 England

    "Other adjuncts" was basically there for oats, right? So if we confirm GNO at this stage then we can always pass on the "other adjuncts" later, and vice versa.

    Similarly, we've got the option to include DRC and skip amber / brown if we wanted to focus on layered caramel flavors, or skip DRC and include brown or amber if we want more complexity in the roasty toasty stuff.

    Or I guess we could chuck everything in for a hot mess, or keep it to pale / C60 / chocolate to keep it understated or leave more room for the hops to shine.

    Basically, I'd be interested to know how people anticipate the balance between caramel / chocolate / coffee / nutty / hoppy / whatever playing out.
     
    #8 Dave_S, Mar 26, 2019
    wspscott likes this.
  9. riptorn

    riptorn Pooh-Bah (1,776) Apr 26, 2018 Georgia
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    That's not a given for individuals of free will.
    In poll 8A I voted "None from this segment", and in poll 8B for GNO and Simpsons DRC. In this one my vote is currently for C-60 + GNO (and not DRC), but I might will a change.

    When the final vote is cast we're all obliged to brew the final recipe exactly as presented....or not.
     
    #9 riptorn, Mar 26, 2019
  10. minderbender

    minderbender Initiate (0) Jan 18, 2009 New York

    I am thinking along these lines as well. Notwithstanding my earlier post, on reflection I'm actually happy to have a complicated malt bill. I am leaning toward amber/brown malt over the Simpsons double-roasted crystal, but I definitely want one or both, rather than going without either of them. So my vote is not set in stone (currently voting for C60 + GNOs).
     
    #10 minderbender, Mar 26, 2019
    SFACRKnight and Arturo2 like this.
  11. TheWorstBrewerEver

    TheWorstBrewerEver Initiate (0) Aug 10, 2016 Norway

    now that i have found a local supplier of Simpsons malt, I say more is more, and that sounds American to me..:-)
     
    #11 TheWorstBrewerEver, Mar 26, 2019
  12. wspscott

    wspscott Pooh-Bah (1,958) May 25, 2006 Kentucky
    Pooh-Bah

    Voted for all three because we have not voted on amounts yet. I think American C malts are boring, but I wanted a mix of different caramel malts in the previous poll, so I will take a mix of American and British caramel malts for this poll.

    I'm happy to change my vote if anyone cares to convince me
     
    #12 wspscott, Mar 26, 2019
    MrOH likes this.
  13. dmtaylor

    dmtaylor Savant (1,149) Dec 30, 2003 Wisconsin

    I think a good American brown ale needs at least 8 or 9 different malts, 4 or 5 different hops, 2 yeasts, none of which are from the USA, a chloride:sulfate ratio of 1000:69, a decoction mash with 4 steps, and a fermentation schedule with 6 ramps. And every voter gets a participation trophy... yay.
     
    #13 dmtaylor, Mar 26, 2019
    wspscott, TheWorstBrewerEver, SFACRKnight and 1 other person like this.
  14. frozyn

    frozyn Maven (1,435) May 16, 2015 New York
    Trader

    ....no lactose?
     
    #14 frozyn, Mar 26, 2019
    wspscott, SFACRKnight, dmtaylor and 1 other person like this.
  15. Arturo2

    Arturo2 Initiate (0) Jan 6, 2019 Oregon

    Still don't understand but I'm just here for the ride and to play along.
    'Sall good.
     
    #15 Arturo2, Mar 26, 2019
  16. Arturo2

    Arturo2 Initiate (0) Jan 6, 2019 Oregon

    Well depending on the number of crystal/chocolate/browns/ambers/adjuncts in the final bill, we might end up with an ounce here or two there and not really giving any of them any room to express.
    For instance C60 won the poll, but can now be relegated to one ounce down the road.
     
    #16 Arturo2, Mar 26, 2019
    MrOH likes this.
  17. Arturo2

    Arturo2 Initiate (0) Jan 6, 2019 Oregon

    OK I chuckled out loud at this ... haha ...
     
    #17 Arturo2, Mar 26, 2019
  18. Arturo2

    Arturo2 Initiate (0) Jan 6, 2019 Oregon

    That was my first inclination too.
    We have pale chocolate for some aroma, flavor, color. Wide open as to how much to use.
    Got C60 for sweetness, body.
    GNO would add the oat aspect but also bring something different.
    Add some amber or brown malt and there's already 4 malts including the GP ... plenty of color and flavor ... and no problem hitting 1.056 OG.
     
    #18 Arturo2, Mar 26, 2019
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  19. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    C-60 has not "won the poll." It advanced to the combo poll. Possibly with (or without) other C-malts. Please read.
     
    #19 VikeMan, Mar 26, 2019
    zimm421 likes this.
  20. Arturo2

    Arturo2 Initiate (0) Jan 6, 2019 Oregon

    I've read it. Still don't get it. But don't mind me.
    In my head, you get the most votes, you win.
    But I guess just like with Trump, the guy who gets less votes can still be president.
    It's cool Vikeman. Let's play on.
    Baroooo!
     
    #20 Arturo2, Mar 27, 2019
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