Enough Coffee Already?

I like coffee in beers, like many people like hops in beer.

I say keep it coming.

 

https://www.beeradvocate.com/beer/profile/700/103229/

They are getting close. I'm just going by memory, I'm sure someone has done it already.

 

So I don't really like coffee. I never drink just regular coffee. If I get anything from time to time it has to be a coffee drink (latte, mocha, something fancier...). I just don't like regular coffee. I try it again from time to time with a big ol nope.

Coffee beer? Bring it on. I don't want it to be a very bitter / black tasting coffee. Something a little creamier. Multiple mentions of Sumatra Mountain Brown here, which was fantastic. Bourbon County Coffee, ooooooohhhh yeah. Griffinclaw Coffee? Keep it coming. Victory at Sea, mmmmmmm.

Love the coffee beer, my preferred way to drink coffee.

 

No.

But, you seem to have tapped into a vein of curmudgeonly* agreement.

*meant in good fun--no malice intended

It's strange, because coffee pale beer is something I had never tried before about a year ago. In that time, I've had at least a half dozen--some IPAs, some Pale Ales, some Kolsch--and it's a style that can be very, very good when done right. It can also be bad (see below). I've had both ends of the spectrum.

That said, this seems like an awfully limiting view of beer. "Sunny Delight" IPAs--which by most accounts do not have anything in them except for water, malt, hops and yeast--are for people who don't like beer? That's an odd position to me.

One of my favorite things about beer is how versatile it is as a beverage. I love that I can find a beer for any different mood I might be in. Sometimes that's a big roasty, non-adjunct RIS. Other times it's a super juicy IPA. Yet other times is a sour beer with fruit, spices and vanilla bean. Or maybe And other

https://www.beeradvocate.com/beer/profile/36912/140365/

A description from the brewer's website:

Now this is our Trip! Combining pale and wheat malts, with the addition of a special variety of coffee beans from our friends at Background Coffee roasters this is a dry, tart and spicy brew the Belgian's (sic) would be proud of. European and American hops then get combined with unique Aussie ingredients like wattle seeds and organic Tasmanian pepper added at the end of the boil to give a dry, clean finish to an already very sessionable Saison.​

Of course, I don't want to get anyone's hopes up too much, because this is one pale beer with coffee that I didn't find good at all, per my note to @beertunes above.

 

I definitely had a coffee saison at Peddler brewing when I visited Seattle last year. I enjoyed it but then again I like coffee and plenty of well made coffee beers.

 

Well, most of the examples that I've had, have such a low hop profile that it seems like I'm not even drinking an IPA. The flavors tend to disappear really quickly, often before I even set the glass back down. I have actually caught myself, with glass in hand, no beer taste in my mouth, wondering if I was picking the glass up, or putting it down. If you can't remember a beer a few seconds after drinking it, how good can it be?

The cynical side of me thinks that a lot of the SunnyD beers get called IPAs, because pretty much anything labeled "IPA" will sell. I just don't find them that interesting. And, their popularity with folks just starting out on their exploration of the beer world, makes me wonder if they are put off by the big, bold, bitter flavors of the more "traditional" IPA's, and these beers give them a way to say "Hey, I like IPAs too, I'm in the club!", without having to drink a beer they don't like. Shrug. Stroke for folks and all that. I still hate coffee though.

 

I reckon that makes you one of them there Poobahs, don't it? And I love coffee and chocolate on their own.

 

This is the same argument that could be made about anything. There are going to be some examples that are well done, and others that are not. When something is popular and enjoyed by many, everyone wants to cash in. Have you noticed the surge of IPAs in the past few years? Due to the fact that coffee (I can't back this up with statistics this very minute, but I would venture to say it is one of, if not the most, popular beverage in the world besides tea) is a very commonly enjoyed drink and goes well with a fair amount of beer styles, it is an obvious extrapolation that coffee in beer is a good combination is the eyes of many brewers in that is a beer that a fair amount of people would enjoy (i.e. more sales). Unfortunately, like anything else, it is not going to be an automatic success just to throw the two together and expect it to be a winner. With the absurd amount of breweries that exist today they can't all be excellent or great at everything or as a brewery in general so some inferior product is inevitable.

As mentioned by many, some styles lend themselves better to coffee than others with stout, porter, and brown ales being the top styles that pair well with it. I love coffee and drink many coffee beers, and I would have to say that coffee stouts are likely my favorite "style" of beer overall. I will say that the coffee IPA is a bit of a stretch to me, and has to be done EXTREMELY well to be successful. I haven't had many coffee IPAs, but Stone did have one on tap recently that was an IPA with blonde roast coffee and it was phenomenal in my opinion. The light roast of the coffee was a perfect addition and the flavors worked well together.

 

I like coffee. I like beer. But generally I feel like combining coffee and beer ruins the finer elements of both.

I agree that a well roasted malt can impart the roast coffee flavor without any need for coffee and generally do so better.

Particularly I don't like the combination of hop-forward beers and coffee. I find the flavors of roasted coffee (or roasted malts) and pine/citrus/grass hops compete with each other, not complement.

I really enjoy that exact breakfast! Now, I don't know about you, but I would never squeeze grapefruit into my coffee and dunk my toast in it; and I certainly don't need a beer to try to replicate that experience for me.

 

I'll use my favorite as an example--Julius--it's 72 IBUs and while it doesn't have the biting, pithy bitterness of some IPAs I've had (and also like, when I'm in the mood), I have a hard time processing it as not drinking like an IPA. Same with other similar ones--like the Tree House beers. Maybe I've simply not had the examples you are thinking of, or more likely we just have very different palates.

I will agree to disagree about why the SunnyD beers are called IPAs. They fit the style parameters by any basic measure. It is a little bit cynical to disqualify them as IPAs simply because they don't match a very narrowly-defined taste parameter. And to be clear--I'm not talking about the IPAs with actual fruit added. I'm talking about the ones that impart a lower perception of bitterness than your "traditional" varieties.

 

I wasn't drinking a lot of coffee beers but have found a few that I like and could enjoy any day. It gets confusing when added to IPA's and other golden lagers but don't really mind coffee in brown or black ales. James Bean was unexpected but I enjoyed it a lot. At the moment it seems everybody is doing it and yeah, it is getting a bit too saturated. On the other hand I hope that some of the better examples will continue to stay around so I can enjoy them now and into the future.

 

Well, no. If entered into competition, they wouldn't even get tasted, they'd lose on appearance alone. Then, at least the ones I've tried, they wouldn't pass on aroma either. If they actually got tasted, they are fundamentally different enough from "regular" IPAs, that they wouldn't stand a chance. I don't have answer to the question of what they should be called, but, at least IMHO, they are different enough that we shouldn't calling, or comparing them to, IPAs. Shrug. YMMV.

 

Peddler has even bottled it before, for anyone out of region that's curious to try it.

 

Put me in the coffee-d out club. It seems like every BA or imperial stout now has coffee added. And as far as coffee IPAs go....just NO!

 

Fair point--although I should have specified that I was talking with regards to the aroma/taste sensory experience.

The only other question I would ask--are the IPAs we're discussing here that much more different from "traditional" IPAs than American IPAs are from English IPAs? I'd argue it's a natural progression... but that argument would take me farther off topic than I've already helped us stray.

So... coffee in beer and stuff!

 

Again, IMHO, yes I think SunnyD's are much farther away from "regular" IPAs, than American IPAs are from English IPAs. The base between American and English is pretty similar, it's the type, and amount, of bolder hops that separate them. The grain bases are pretty similar, in general, and yeast variation is what it is.

The SD's, on the other hand, just seem to be completely different animals. Visually, there is no comparison, that's obvious. The aroma varies, and at least the ones I've tried, tend to have softer hop notes, and no grain or malt scents. On the tongue, the hops can be bright upfront, but are muted in the middle, and virtually nonexistent at the back. The body will vary, to brewers preference, but the new ones tend to be lighter than the regulars. And, as I mentioned above, the finish is usually nowhere to be found.

That's just me, and, I was wrong once before, so, theoretically, it could happen again.

 

Never had a beer that was better with added coffee flavor than without it.

 

I dunno man....Carton Regular Coffee (as well as it's different variants) are too delicious to say "enough cofee". Enough grapefruit already, I say (and this is coming from someone who loves grapefruit).

 

hate to break it to you:

Huss Brewing Koffee Kolsch

(it's actually a really tasty beer though...like a cold-brewed iced coffee. I was expecting a disaster)